GCI Equipper

Epiphany

The “aha” moments of seeing the Light.

There are three “aha” events associated with the season of Epiphany. They are the visit of the Magi (wise men) from the East, Jesus’ baptism by John in the river Jordan, and Jesus’ first miracle of turning water into wine. What is your “aha” moment?

The Magi and the star

Only Matthew shares the story of the Magi, who aren’t named. Their identity isn’t nearly as important as their story. They had an “aha” moment when they saw a new star. Here are some interesting points:

  • The Bible doesn’t say how many Magi there were. Tradition determined the number from the three gifts given.
  • The term Magi was used to identify astrologers, seers, and fortune tellers. The story leads us to believe these men studied the stars, and all three discovered a new one, which they followed from the East all the way to Bethlehem.
  • They called the star “his star,” indicating this was a new light in the skies, from which they determined it was the star of a future king. We can only speculate how that was determined.
  • They gave three gifts – gold, frankincense, and myrrh. Tradition tells us gold is for a king, incense for God, and myrrh used to anoint the dead.

 The dove and the identity

All four Gospels share the story of Jesus’ baptism, which was an “aha” moment for all four of them. Matthew, Mark, and Luke use similar terminology describing this event:

And when Jesus had been baptized, just as he came up from the water, suddenly the heavens were opened to him and he saw God’s Spirit descending like a dove and alighting on him. And a voice from the heavens said, “This is my Son, the Beloved, with whom I am well pleased.” (Matthew 3:16-17 NRSVUE)

Not only was this a miraculous vision, but it was also a clear identification of who Jesus is. This event caused a number to “see the light” and start to follow Jesus. Two disciples began following Jesus right after John shared the story of Jesus’ baptism (John 1:35-36).

The water and the wine

John shares the story of the wedding at Cana where Jesus turned water into wine. I love how he finishes the story:

Jesus did this, the first of his signs, in Cana of Galilee and revealed his glory, and his disciples believed in him. (John 2:11 NRSVUE)

Epiphany “aha” moments lead to belief.

  • The wise men saw the light in a star, and they believed.
  • The Gospel writers saw the light in the descending of a dove and hearing the identity of the Messiah, and they believed.
  • The disciples saw the light in the miracle of water being turned into wine and seeing Jesus’ glory, and they believed.

I like the way Bobby Gross summarizes this season on page 84 in his book, “Living the Christian Year: Time to Inhabit the Story of God.”

The season of Epiphany is a season for seeing more of Christ’s glory by focusing on his life and mission. Simultaneously, it’s a time for making that glory better to known those around us. We bear witness to what we have seen and learned and experienced.”

Epiphany is a time to pay close attention to “seeing” what Jesus has done and what he is doing. As Jesus said to the disciples in John’s Gospel, “Come and see” (John 1:39). When we see we can share by telling the story – the story of Jesus, the story of how Jesus has transformed us, the story of his love for all. And when we tell the story, more and more have “aha” moments and see the light.

Following are some spiritual practices for the season of Epiphany:

  • Ask God for a specific person with whom you can share your story of transformation in Christ. Ask him for the courage to share that story.
  • Choose a few friends to specifically pray for during Epiphany; ask God to help them see how Jesus is impacting their lives.
  • Read through the book of John and focus on the miracles he shares; how does each miracle show a bit more about who Jesus is.
  • Pay attention to some God sightings or divine appointments and treat each as an “aha” moment. Then share some of these moments with someone else.
  • Ask God to help you have the courage to mention Jesus more in natural conversation with friends, family, and coworkers.

May God fill you with “aha” moments throughout the season of Epiphany. Please feel free to share them.

Epiphany Blessings,
Rick Shallenberger
Editor

Loving in the Light

The season of Epiphany helps us focus on how Jesus helps us love others amid any hurt, anger, or offense.

By Daphne Sidney, Superintendent Australasia

Is there any worldly philosophy that would tell us to love our enemy? If asked for my coat, that I give the person an extra one? If I am slapped on the cheek, that I turn and give my other cheek? What about fairness and justice?

The verses I referenced are not political statements but personal ones as Jesus made clear in his Sermon on the Mount, and established throughout his life. We are not to take revenge and not to hate back when shown hate. Rather, we are to love our enemies and pray for those who persecute us.

The world’s expectation for hurt is to retaliate, to respond in equal force at least proportionately, if not more, just to teach them a lesson. To overcome and not retaliate or harbour animosity to personal slights is difficult, no doubt about that. It is only in and with the divine light of Jesus, living in the power of his love with the help of the Holy Spirit, that we are enabled to respond differently.

Jesus is the light shining in the darkness of this world – this is the theme of Epiphany; he brings light to replace darkness. The apostle Peter enlightens us about the life and character of Jesus who faced  angry mobs at times because he had a way of turning everything upside down.

When they hurled their insults at him, he did not retaliate; when he suffered, he made no threats. Instead, he entrusted himself to him who judges justly. (1 Peter 2:23 NIV)

We see that Jesus entrusted the justice of the situation to his Father. Rather than depending on his own powers – which he had – he committed the situation into his Father’s hands. Knowing that justice is ultimately with God means we can be at peace and put our hurts to rest[1]

Let’s not gloss over this. Here was a divine being who poured out his divinity to become human. Then, as a human, he poured himself out again on the cross, taking every insult, pain, and rejection one could imagine. He took it all upon himself, nobody else. It was on the Cross that all this was dealt with – for us. We need to bring all our pains, hurts, and offenses, and lay them at the Cross. And leave them there, allowing our Father to remind us that we have received great mercy and forgiveness for our own sins. Because of this great gift, we can extend mercy and forgiveness to others. Jesus gives us the life and strength to do that. Notice again what Peter said:

To this you were called, because Christ suffered for you, leaving you an example, that you should following his steps. He committed no sin, and no deceit was found in his mouth. He himself bore our sins in his body on the cross, so that we might die to sins and live for righteousness. (1 Peter 2:21-24 NIV)

It is said of Mother Teresa that she found great strength and sustenance through prayer, bringing her close to Jesus, whom she came to know in a very personal way. In this way she was able to recognize Christ in others. This is a wonderful key to not only loving others but to forgiving others. As Jesus said …whatever you did for one of these least brothers of mine, you did for me (Matthew 25:40).

In this we have a wonderful freedom – at the Cross of Jesus we can lay down our battles and release the anger and hate and any need for payback. Instead of payback we are exhorted to “pray back,” to love our enemies and pray for them. We live in deep gratitude for what Jesus has done for us, for his immense love, grace, mercy, and compassion, all in the face of what he suffered, to set us free. As we draw close to Jesus in a personal relationship through prayer we are strengthened and sustained to reflect the light – Jesus, who is the source of love, compassion, and forgiveness for all peoples.

P.S. I am not trying to address bullying or domestic violence here. Abuse is wrong, and it should be called out so that it can be addressed, and nobody is obliged to live with constant ongoing abuse. Please seek help should you need some counsel or help in this area.

[1] Tyndale NT Commentaries I Peter W Grudem 1988

Hate the Sin and Love the Sinner?

Is this concept even possible?

Glen A Weber, Central Regional Support Team

Over recent decades there has been a great deal of discussion by Christians about the “major sins” of our society – abortion, LGBTQ+, questions of gender and so many more activities of which many Christians disapprove. As a community, the Christian church has wrestled – and often disagreed – with how to address these issues.

Many have accepted the common statement, “hate the sin and love the sinner.” As I have considered this topic, I have found it quite difficult to make the two thoughts work together. Can I truly love the “sinner” with agape love, while also hating their actions?

  • When that friend comes home completely inebriated, can I really love him and still hate something about him?
  • When a family member shares they are in a relationship with someone of the same sex, do I love her and hate the relationship (or the other person)?
  • When a friend is transitioning from one gender to another, can I fully love her and hate who she feels she is in her human body?
  • When millions of babies are aborted each year, can I hate the actions of the doctors and nurses while still loving them?

I don’t know about you, but I find it quite difficult to separate the actions from the person. My experience finds that many who claim they only hate the sin, also have a very negative feeling toward the sinner.

Love the sinner

The majority of Christians would agree that we are to love the sinner.

We know that Jesus reached out to those who were considered outcasts by the culture of his day. He reached out to the woman caught in adultery, to the tax collectors who were taking advantage of (“cheating”) their Jewish neighbors and even forgave humanity while we had him hanging on the cross.

Jesus told us to love our enemies and to pray for those who persecute us. (Matt. 5:43-45)

Hate the sin

Throughout the Old Testament, God is referred to as hating sin. He had established a law for Israel, and they were expected to live in agreement with that law. They seldom did. God is referred to as hating their idols, the way they observed their sabbaths, the rapidity with which they divorced their wives, their adultery within their marriages, but also their national adultery with other foreign powers. It’s clear God was quite distressed with the consequences the people suffered as a result of turning away from him and living in sinful ways. And that’s what he hated – the hurt they caused themselves, the consequences they faced as the result of their sin. God hates sin because it hurts those he loves, and it tells us lies about who we are in him.

Two thousand years ago, God revealed that the time had fully come for him to deal with the sin issue. He could have snapped his fingers and forced everyone into obedience – but that would have taken away human freedom. Instead, he became one of us through the womb of Mary. He entered our fallenness by becoming human. Even though born into our fallenness, Jesus walked perfectly with the Father and lived a godly life to overcome that fallenness.

Jesus took the punishment and the curse of the law for us.

Now it is evident that no one is reckoned as righteous before God by the law, for “the one who is righteous will live by faith.” But the law does not rest on faith; on the contrary, “Whoever does the works of the law will live by them.” Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”— in order that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the gentiles, so that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith. (Galatians 3:11-14 NRSV)

The apostle Paul often wrote to the believers that Jesus Christ gave himself for our sins that we might be set free from the present evil age. (Galatians 1:3-5)

Through Jesus Christ’s Incarnation and sacrifice, he has changed the way we see the people around us. God has now reconciled all to himself. He loved all of humanity all along, but now opened the way for our hearts to love him.

For the love of Christ urges us on, because we are convinced that one has died for all; therefore all have died. 1And he died for all, so that those who live might live no longer for themselves but for the one who for their sake died and was raised.  From now on, therefore, we regard no one from a human point of view (emphasis mine); even though we once knew Christ from a human point of view, we no longer know him in that way. (2 Corinthians 5:14-16 NRSV)

Later in this passage, Paul tells us to invite those around us to be reconciled to the Father, who has already reconciled them to himself. Paul doesn’t tell the believers anything about hating their sins and or correcting them or judging them for their actions.

That is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting the message of reconciliation to us. (2 Corinthians 5:19 NRSV)

If God – through the life of Jesus Christ – doesn’t look at people around us – even unbelievers – through a human point of view, and no longer counts their sins against them, how can we?

Does God’s heart break for the consequences of people’s actions? Yes! Should our heart lament when we see people suffering because of their/our actions? Definitely!

It does not seem that God is wringing his hands over the sins of humanity; he has already forgiven us and redeemed us. Does that mean he no longer hates sin? Absolutely not. Sin causes us pain, it breaks relationships, it tells us lies about who we are. God’s wrath is toward the things that hurt us and lie to us. Only God can truly hate sin and unconditionally love his creation. He chooses to look at humanity through the life of Jesus Christ and rejoices that so many more of his children are now populating his kingdom – even when they don’t know it!

It doesn’t seem that God is calling us to “love the sinner and hate the sin.” It seems he is calling us to love the sinner – period (full stop for those using Commonwealth English). We can pray for them to come to know Jesus Christ and if the opportunity presents itself, invite them to step into the reconciliation that is already theirs because of the vicarious sin-forgiving work of Jesus. Remind them, “You are reconciled, so be reconciled!”

Measuring Church Health

It’s not a check list, it’s discerning God’s plan.

By Cara Garrity, Development Coordinator

GCI’s vision continues to be Healthy Church. What does it mean to be healthy? How do we assess “health”?  Is it even appropriate to measure the “health” of our local congregations?

I want to take a moment to offer an image of health that I hold in mind when I consider what it practically means to pursue our Healthy Church vision.

Recently I have been trying to learn how to take care of plants. So far, I have killed more plants than I have kept alive, but I have learned a lot in the process. The most helpful thing I’ve learned is that plants give us signs that provide information about what they need. When we pay attention to these signs, we can respond in a way that cultivates growth. If we ignore or do not recognize these signs, we may get lucky and make choices that accidentally cultivate growth, or like I have too often done, we may kill the plant.

This process of knowing, recognizing, and cultivating plant growth is personalized – each plant has different signs of health and stress, resiliencies, conditions under which they thrive, and conditions that will kill them overnight. To know whether a plant is thriving or dying, we have to know the plant.

For example, some succulents turn a beautiful pink when left in direct sunlight. It’s easy to think that the vibrant color is a sign that the plant is happy and healthy, but it’s actually a sign that the plant is under stress from too much sun. If it is not moved to a different location, it will eventually die.

Or consider the Christmas cactus that produces beautiful blooms in the winter season. In the spring and summer, when many common flowering plants bloom, it does not. It may be tempting to believe that the lack of springtime blooms means that the plant is not doing well. But, in fact, it is simply dormant and reserving its strength for the next blooming season, which for this plant, happens to be winter.

This has changed how I approach caring for my plants. I used to treat the plants generically; all the plants got watered on the same day, given the same amount of sunlight, put in the same soil, and all expected to thrive. I killed so many plants this way.

Now I get to know the plant and continually look for signs to assess and measure the health of the plant before I decide what needs to be done. When I look for these signs that provide information about the health of a plant, it is not for the purpose of perfection or to prove that the plant is good enough. It is so that I can understand what I can provide to help it thrive. A thriving plant is not necessarily predictable, perfect, or grandiose, but it is ALIVE.

I like to think about Healthy Church vision like this. Attending to the health of our local congregation is not a matter of mere compliance, applying a one-size fits all regimen, ticking off a checklist, or any other tedious task. It is a continual process of discerning the personalized signs of health for each local congregation as you come alive in Christ, worship, participate in his ministry, and share the joy of his life with your neighborhood. It is about paying attention so that you may respond in wisdom.

Let us learn to practically measure signs of health in our local congregation so that we may participate in what God is doing in our midst with great intentionality. Let us be a thriving expression of his church in our neighborhood – not necessarily predictable, perfect, or grandiose, but ALIVE in him.

National Advisory Council for Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion

The who, what, where, and why of the DEI council.

By Jeff Broadnax and Dishon Mills

What is the Council’s mission? GCI’s National Council on Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (or D.E.I. Council) is a fellowship of local ministry leaders who advise the Superintendent of North America on ways to live out the gospel through unity, belonging, and racial healing in all our U.S. churches. We address injustice, hatred, and division by developing strategies that help cultivate mutual understanding and respect. We present these strategies as recommendations to the superintendent. By the Holy Spirit, we seek to intentionally and proactively follow Jesus’ example and teaching, valuing every human being as an adopted child of the Father.

What is the Council’s vision? GCI’s National Council on Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion sees our denomination reflecting the diversity in unity of the Father, Son, and Spirit. GCI will boldly proclaim that Jesus, who is revealed in Scripture as the embodiment of the gospel, is the end of the sins of injustice, hatred, oppression, and division and provide ways in which believers can practically live out their faith. Our congregations celebrate differences and welcome people from all backgrounds, valuing their stories. Our members are peacemakers, and our congregations spread faith, healing, and community.

What is the Council’s biblical foundation? The D.E.I. Council bases its efforts on the Bible’s exhortation to participate in Christ’s work to make peace, bring unity, and reconcile the world. Our foundational passage is from Ephesians 4.

As a prisoner for the Lord, then, I urge you to live a life worthy of the calling you have received. Be completely humble and gentle; be patient, bearing with one another in love. Make every effort to keep the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace. There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called; one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all. (Ephesians 4:1-6 NIV)

How does the Council support GCI’s vision of healthy church?

Faith Avenue (Discipleship): Reconciliation is for all. Christians are invited to participate in Christ’s ministry of reconciliation.  Following this recommendation will help our members be peacemakers.

Hope Avenue (Worship): Our churches are for all. This recommendation will help our congregations be welcoming environments for all — where all stories are heard and valued.

Love Avenue (Witness): Jesus is good news for all. As we ask our congregations to engage their communities, we should take steps and training to ensure that personal biases do not prevent members from engaging groups they may see as different. This recommendation will equip congregations to cross cultural barriers.

Who are the Council members? Jeff Broadnax and Dishon Mills (coordinators), Kairis Colter-Chiari (Sacramento, CA), Karina DeLeRosa (Santa Ana, CA), Philip Doele (Decatur, GA), Bermie Dizon (Glendora, CA), Jose Lopez (Hawthorne, CA), Tommie Grant Jr. (Ladson, SC), Tamar Gray (Cleaveland, OH), Terry McDonald (Kansas City, MO), John Newsom (Queens, NY), Gabriel Ojih (Richardson, TX), Celestine Olive (Lancaster, CA), Ron Washington (Livonia, MI)

How is the Council implementing diversity training? After much prayer and research, we settled on Mile’s McPherson’s The Third Option Similarity Training. This is a Christ-centered inclusive approach to diversity, equity, and inclusion. In Phase 1, we started with a training session for our original council members, GCI Board, and Home Office staff, which includes the regional directors. In Phase 2, we moved toward training a group who can train pastors and ministry leaders. These include Jeff Broadnax, Dishon Mills, Bermie Dizon, Tamar Gray, Gabriel Ojih, John Newsom, Terry McDonald, Ron Washington, and we’ve added Michael Mitchell (Kingston, Jamaica), and Susan McKie (Lake Tahoe, NV). Phase 3 training, which consists of sIx sessions, will begin in 2024 at our Regional Gatherings and other locations.

Church Hack: Testimony Best Practice

A testimony is a personal account or narrative shared by an individual to express the transformation they have experienced in Christ. Sharing a testimony is a sacred practice that magnifies Christ and celebrates the transformative power of faith. This month’s Church Hack outlines the purpose and impact of giving a testimony as well as best practices for sharing your personal story effectively. Click the link below for more tips and guidance on sharing your testimony.

https://resources.gci.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/2023-CH12-Testimony-Best-Practices.pdf

We Need a Plan

Participating in the work of Christ to draw our young people to himself requires some planning.

By Dishon Mills, Pastor, Steele Creek, N.C.

Tis’ the season for New Year’s resolutions! As we take down the Christmas decorations, gym memberships go up! The New Year inspires people to examine their lives and look for areas of improvement. About half of Americans make resolutions. Sadly, only around 8% of people who make resolutions achieve their goals. Those who do have some things in common: their resolutions are SMART (specific, measurable, achievable, relevant, and time-bound) goals; they give themselves grace when they make missteps; they adopt the mindset that some progress is better than none; and they involve their community of friends and family for support.

 

I believe this is a good lesson to apply to our children and youth ministries. I am not advocating for you to make New Year’s resolutions; I am encouraging you to be strategic about making improvements. In a past life, I worked as a consultant for nonprofit organizations, especially those who worked with children. I used to ask my clients, “Are you serving children better this year than you did last year? How do you know?” As those who disciple children, we should ask ourselves the same questions. Are we doing a good job discipling children? How do we know? Are we getting better at connecting young people to Jesus?

Notice what Paul wrote to believers in Ephesus.

Be very careful, then, how you live — not as unwise but as wise, making the most of every opportunity, because the days are evil. Therefore do not be foolish, but understand what the Lord’s will is. (Ephesians 5:15-17 NIV)

When it comes to children and youth ministry, we need to be careful and make sure we are making the most of every opportunity with our young people. One of the ways we do this is through the development of a ministry action plan (MAP). A good MAP does not simply list the activities that you have planned, although it should do that. A good MAP explains the goals you hope to achieve. It answers the question, “What is the point of our activities?” Taking our cue from successful makers of New Year’s resolutions, we should share our MAP with the congregation’s community to both get their help and prayer. Ultimately, our planning should result in us continually listening to the Holy Spirit for guidance and direction.

If we want to participate in the work of Christ to draw our young people to himself, we need to make a plan. More accurately, we need to discern the Spirit’s plan for us. As Paul said in Ephesians, we need to “understand what the Lord’s will is.” The good news is that God wants good things for our young people. He wants to reveal Christ to them and make them new. Let us do all we can to participate in that good work.

 

Discernment and Mapping Pt 1 w/ Hector and Juan Carlos Barrero

Video unavailable (video not checked).

In this episode, our host, Cara Garrity, interviews Hector Barrero, GCI pastor in Bogotá, Colombia, and his son, Juan Carlos “Juanka” Barrero, Hope Avenue Champion in Bogotá. Together they discuss practices of discernment and strategic planning.


“We evaluate the goals based on the questions that the MAP proposes. And the questions are like this, does this outreach provide the opportunities for church members to volunteer and serve? So important. Does this give the opportunity for neighbors, for the community, and for organizations to participate with the church in events that are not … the Sunday gatherings and are more related with the community? Also, another question that we ask is, is this outreach inclusive?” — Juanka Barrero

 

Main Points:

  • What best practice have you found that helps your team plan together? 1:23
  • What process do you use to decide team priorities? 3:03
  • How do you unite as a team in your planning so that you/your ministry avenues do not become silos with completely separate plans and priorities? 7:18
  • How does your team work together to articulate specific Healthy Church growth goals in you MAP based on your priorities? 14:29
  • How is preparing a strategic MAP different from a document that lists what activities/events will be done? 23:37

 

Resources:

  • Ministry Action Plans – an Equipper article with templates and practical input for developing your Ministry Action Plan.
  • Google Sheets – a resource mentioned by Juan Carlos that allows their team to collaborate on online spreadsheets in real-time
  • Church Juice – an organization dedicated to church communication resources and best practices.

 

Follow us on SpotifyGoogle Podcast, and Apple Podcast

Program Transcript


Discernment and Mapping Pt 1 w/ Hector and Juan Carlos Barrero

Welcome to the GC Podcast, a podcast to help you develop into the healthiest ministry leader you can be by sharing practical ministry experience.


Cara: Hello friends and welcome to today’s episode of GC Podcast. This podcast is devoted to exploring best ministry practices in the context of Grace Communion International churches.

I’m your host, Cara Garrity, and this is the first episode of 2024. And in this first quarter of 2024, we’re switching things up a little bit. We’re going to be bringing you three mini episodes focused on the process and practices of discernment, strategic planning, and ministry action plans (MAP).

And so today here to talk with us about their experiences with Team Based—Pastor Led discernment, strategic planning, and ministry action plans are Pastor Hector and Juanka, coming to us from Comunión de Gracia Internacional Bogotá. Thank you both so much for being here with us today.

Juanka: Hello, everybody. How are you?

[00:01:08] Cara: We’re doing well. We’re doing well. I appreciate y’all spending your time today. And so why don’t we just jump right in because we got some mini episodes, and I know y’all have some really insightful things to share with us in just a little bit of time.

So, when we talk about team-based discernment and planning for the ministry locally there in Bogotá, what is a best practice that you guys have found that helps your team plan all together?

[00:01:36] Juanka: Yes, Cara, thank you for that question.

We can honestly tell you that we can describe our planning into virtual planning meetings and face-to-face planning meetings, using the MAP. And definitely virtual meetings are more practical for maybe the first part of planning. And the face-to-face meetings are also very important because we plan, and we analyze what we did. Maybe more ideas are shared.

And generally speaking, we gathered via Zoom to collaborate and that’s the best practice that we have. And within those two practices, they complement each other. As I mentioned before, we use the MAP document or the idea of the ministry action plan. Basically, that’s what we have.

Very practical and very cut to the chase.

[00:02:53] Cara: I like that, practical and cut to the chase. That’s good. Just get to those priorities of participating in Jesus’s ministry.

And that idea of cutting to the chase: when your team’s coming together to plan, in these meetings virtually and in person, what process do you use to decide what your priorities are going to be either that year or that month that quarter?

[00:03:22] Juanka: Yes, most of the time we meet for example on December the 1st or some time in December, let’s say. And we write down all the necessary and most important events and ideas based on our calendar. Our calendar is the most important thing for us.

It’s like our infrastructure. Let’s say that the calendar has everything related to every single Avenue’s planning. In that calendar, we have all of the activities and the events with the dates, with the person in charge. So, the calendar is something super important, and so the calendar has to be ready beforehand.

We can modify it in the Zoom meetings that we are telling you about. And in those meetings, we, as a team, step-by-step, can determine which tasks are truly important for each Avenue and for each ministry.

And because of this, we have to stick to a schedule and some dates that reflect, for example, the priorities, and how are we going to fulfill those priorities. So as a team, again, the calendar is so important.

And finally, I guess I will say that the process to decide those priorities is that we gather with each ministry leader, and we evaluate the goals based on the following questions, right? The questions that the MAP proposes.

And the questions are like this, does this outreach provide the opportunities for church members to volunteer and serve? So important. Does this give the opportunity for neighbors, for the community, and for organizations to participate with the church in events that are not, for example, the Sunday mass or the Sunday gatherings and are more related with the community?

Also, another question that we ask is, is this outreach inclusive? For example, if we want to go and make an event for elderly or for children, are we being inclusive for the community? And all of these priorities and all of these plans are based on: how can we make our community participate in what we’re doing?

Yes, basically that’s the answer.

[00:06:25] Cara: Yes, and I don’t want it to be lost, that last thing that you said. When your ministry leaders come together, you filter through these questions for priorities. Really, it’s filtering through these questions that help you identify: are these things in alignment with the purpose of our church and the particular ways that your local church in Bogotá is wanting to and feeling like God is inviting you to be present in your neighborhood and to engage that local community?

Because that’s the priority to be the church. And I think that’s an excellent practice that you guys have, to come together and identify those priorities.

And then I love that idea of the calendar. That’s really practical and an excellent way to do that. And that speaks to even this next question that I have for you. As a whole team in the church, what are some ways that you come together as a team when you plan, so that the Avenues don’t become disconnected and put together completely separate plans or priorities that don’t have anything to do with each other?

[00:07:43] Hector: I would say, Cara—this is Hector—that in our monthly meetings with everybody, with all the leaders, we make emphasis in our friendship, we share together. And we take time to share with each other. So, our meetings are very friendly, and all of us give ideas. In fact, the calendar is open for everybody to add ideas. Not right in the meetings, but after the meetings.

For example, anybody can get into the calendar and add an idea. And we have a system to approve those ideas or to say no. It’s not the moment. It’s not the time, for example. So, everybody participates in a direct way in what we are doing. And we have been seeing a different environment, I would say, or a context different than before, and it is that everybody is participating.

I am really moved, could I say that, to see how people are getting involved in everything, in every aspect of the church because of this way of doing things. It is more intentional too in our meetings, our friendship, and inviting everybody to participate.

[00:09:13] Cara: Yeah, thank you for sharing that. I love how there’s a relational foundation there. That in those relationships, that’s what that collaboration in ministry participation is built out of.

And I love how you’re saying there’s been that increase in people participating and being in that, and people can have that direct, hands-on participation.

I also want to highlight that you said you have a system; everyone gets to share their ideas and put their ideas out there and everyone’s voice is heard. And you also have a system for how those ideas are approved or maybe “not right now” or “later.” So that it’s clear to the team, to the members of the church, how those decisions are being made. That’s so excellent. I love that.

[00:10:09] Juanka: The system basically is a sheet file like on Google. And we have nine or ten sheets on Google that we shared with all the ministry leaders and all the people in charge of the Avenues, the servers in all the ministries of the church. And basically, they can upload information, and they can write their plans because there’s a space for everybody, and they will communicate what they’re doing, what they’re planning.

Basically, we have the mission, the vision, the goals, the theme of the year, our values, and it’s divided into several important topics in which we can access anytime, anywhere.

So, it is a practical system, and we can see what the youth ministry, for example, has planned for next Sunday. Anybody can see it. We have support from the other ministries in case someone wants to attend or wants to help. And so, this is definitely working for us. I had the idea of using the MAP, but sharing the document for all, not all the members of the church, but all the people involved in the ministry, in the leadership.

[00:12:02] Cara: Yes. And as you say that it makes me think that then those lines of communication are open, right? Like you said, you can see what Children’s Church is doing as a leader of another area, and then that support can come or even that collaboration. As leaders, you know what each other is doing and so you can support one another, and it’s clear what is happening. That really strengthens that team-based aspect of your planning.

[00:12:38] Hector: I have seen that everybody wants to participate doing things this way. And I am so glad that everybody is feeling more important, in the sense that they know that their opinion is important. And it is. Their opinion is important for all of us.

And it has given them, all the leaders, some maturity and also respect in the sense that their ideas are taken into consideration and their participation is growing more and more. And frankly, I feel so happy with that because I don’t have to do everything. I am allowed now to take my rest.

I concentrate on giving my sermons whenever I have to preach. I see more people capable and prepared and able and with the desire to preach. So that’s very good. And things happen even without me knowing every specific aspect. So, it’s good to see everybody working and doing their own job.

[00:14:03] Cara: Pastor, that makes me so happy too. When we say Team Based—Pastor Led, what you’ve just described there is exactly that. And just the words that came to mind, really what y’all are doing, you’re equipping the saints for participation in Jesus’s ministry. That’s beautiful, it’s a beautiful thing.

And I’m wondering as you’re doing that and participation is increasing and people are feeling like their gifts and their opinions are valued, how do you continue to work together to articulate those specific goals that you have that are being written out?

Like Juanka, I heard you mention that you’ll have a specific theme for the year and these specific goals each time. How do you work together to articulate what those specific aspects are each year for your congregation?

[00:15:06] Juanka: Great question. Great question. For example, our theme 2023 is “Rebuilding the Church,” starting from scratch, let’s say, because of the pandemic situation, because many things changed.

And so, we wanted to have a vision to be a church that honors God by proclaiming the message of Jesus Christ through community service, so that people can grow in faith, hope, and love in a way that makes a difference in their lives. And basically, with saying this, we wanted to focus a little bit more on the Love Avenue.

We are, I will say, pretty strong in the Hope Avenue. We have been [for] years having incredible rhythms for the gatherings and the worship and the sermons. But we needed to go out. So, this leads to this incredible opportunity of having our first Outside the Walls event.

It was on August 26, 2023, and basically to answer your question, we just gathered as I told you before. First virtually, we discussed ideas. Sometimes it’s challenging because there are too many ideas, and we have to get, again, practical, and to write things that are understandable for everybody. So, we took some time defining the terms, but once the terms are defined, the values are defined, the goals for each Avenue, including the pastoral avenue, are defined.

So, we will gather face-to-face, and that’s where all the magic happens, we make plans, we talk about budgets, we talk about providers, everything. And we make sure that the plan is going to work and because of that, it is so important to gather first virtually and then face-to-face be aligned with the concept of a healthy church in our mission vision and objectives.

[00:17:26] Cara: That is such an intentional process. Can you tell us a little bit more … or go ahead, Hector. Were you going to add?

[00:17:40] Hector: Yes, I was going to mention that I was impressed with that activity, this first Outside the Walls activity. It was so impressive for myself that I was not confident that it was going to be a success.

I was the first one who was in doubt. I wasn’t secure. It was the first time we were going to work and invite the children of our community to an activity. Our strong point in the past was inviting through radio, but this time it was not radio. It was going house by house, building after building, inviting people of our community to bring their children to our community.

And I said, no, nobody is going to come. I think that is going to be very difficult. I was very negative at the beginning. But this work of teamwork, that everybody was so enthusiastic, inspired me.

To see people involved, people planning, calling the providers of services to this activity, all of them doing their work, ended up in an excellent activity.

We had a lot of people, and the fruit of that is that we have new people attending our weekly church services, and I am looking forward to the next event. I am totally changed by this activity. I now know that it is possible to reach our community.

And I am very enthusiastic now. I changed my point of view from very negative—I have to confess that—to a mind of faith and to be more secure that things are possible. Yes, we can do things, and people will respond. If we have good planning and activities and things to offer, people will come.

[00:20:04] Cara: Praise God. Praise God for that. And I really admire that in the intentionality of your planning that—and you mentioned this, Pastor Hector—within the teamwork, that you guys were able to pursue a goal that maybe felt bigger than any one of you thought you could do on your own or it was something really new, right?

Juanka, you even mentioned that the Love Avenue was not the Avenue that felt the strongest for you all at first, but you intentionally, in discernment, you thought about: Look, we’ve had this pandemic. What does it mean to rebuild the church? This, for you, meant to be in your community and to focus on the Love Avenue.

And so that opportunity to come together as a team and to discern and be intentional, wow, how powerful that’s been! Just hearing the difference that’s made for you all as leaders, for your community, and for your gathering church membership, that’s incredible.

It’s incredible to hear.

[00:21:21] Hector: I would say that to release people, to allow them to participate is the results are incredible, because people take their responsibility to levels that are higher than even what you expect. And people participate when you give them the opportunity. They will give everything, more than what you think they will be involved with.

I saw them involved with a lot of enthusiasm. It was a surprise for me to see those results and everybody was enjoying their assignment. So, it was excellent. It was a good experience.

[00:22:13] Cara: I love that.

[00:22:14] Juanka: Yeah. In addition to this, we are also grateful because of the support from GCI, because of Pastor Heber and all of the ideas of the Avenues were crucial in making this possible, especially to expanding the Love Avenue.

Four years ago, we were not centered, and we were not thinking about the Avenues and how they are so important and different phases of the church, different missions of the church. So basically, yes. Thank you so much for your support because you guys are always creating ideas and different perspectives and different documents and things that allow us—all the churches in Latin America and in the world—have these rhythms and good practices that allow the Spirit to just touch people and reach with the love of Christ.

[00:23:28] Cara: Amen. It’s an expression of a team based all across the denomination, right? Yeah. So good to see. I have one last question for you guys for today.

One of the things I’ve been struck with is the intentionality that you all have had in your planning with your team. And so how is preparing a strategic ministry action plan, an intentional ministry action plan different for you all than just a to-do list of things? Like, we’re going to do this this year and this this month.

What difference has that made for you guys in the local congregation?

[00:24:11] Juanka: Yeah, excellent question. Maybe talking about the opportunity to expand our minds with new material, I will say that the difference of just writing down a to-do list is that we can actually create like a more organized system. In our case, we created this sheet, a Google file, that everybody can see and  the TMAP [team ministry action plan] and the IMAP [individual ministry action plan] which you guys shared. I think it was in last month’s Equipper. It’s definitely applicable because everybody knows what to do. There are due dates, there are responsibilities, a person in charge of something or some process. And everybody is organized, focused on what needs to be done, and at the same time, we are informed of the process.

We can see, in a nutshell, for example, what is happening with the ministry, the children’s ministry, or with the worship ministry, and how we are participating in an event. And it is beautiful to say this because we feel part of a community.

Sometimes in the past it felt like you were living, for example, your job during the week and then Saturdays and Sundays at church, but now you’re connected all the time. And so, there are more conversations, there’s more information, more ideas. And definitely this ministry action plan is way different than just a to-do list.

A to-do list works maybe for an individual, but the ministry action plan and the TMAP and IMAP, I will say that they organize better. Our ideas, they make better and the process easier. Because we don’t have to create anything because you guys sent everything for us just to write down the specifics and all the things that we need to do to reach the goals.

[00:26:41] Hector: I would add that we cannot take for granted this job that Heber has been doing with us through more than a year and teaching us the basic things: Love Avenue, Hope Avenue, Faith Avenue. It sounds very easy, but it takes time to pass the ideas to the congregation, to the leaders.

So, I feel that we already did that job, which is great in my opinion. I think that everybody now understands which are the things we are working on. And it is clear for the congregation, which is very important because everybody knows now that there is a Faith Avenue, a Hope Avenue, a Love Avenue, and what does it mean.

And everybody wants to participate somehow in one of these three areas. And for me, that’s an accomplishment. It’s something that, of course, we didn’t do by ourselves. It was, again, your support and Heber’s support. I think that we already are in a situation in which everybody understands those basic concepts.

[00:28:19] Cara: Yeah. And that lays such a great foundation to move forward in unity, in vision, and ministry. Oh, this has been so rich! Thank you so much for sharing some of your experience with us. I know that it’ll be helpful to our listeners because this is just so practical. Like you said at the start, we’ll just cut to the chase and bring that focus.

And so, thank you for spending your time with us today. Pastor Hector, would you be willing to say a prayer over our pastors and ministry leaders in GCI for their processes of discernment, strategic planning, and putting together ministry action plans?

[00:29:10] Hector: Yes, of course. So let us pray.

We are so thankful, our Lord Jesus, for what you are doing with our denomination. Our prayers as pastors are for you to stay with us, to provide us the ideas, the planning, all those things that make our church, our denomination continue going forward, growing as a healthy church.

I want to bless our president, Greg,  the job he’s doing, with so many people around him, all of them doing a great job. We ask for your blessing for our denomination; we always pray for us. I always remember that we paid a high price to come out from our past and be in this beautiful present and to have a beautiful future.

Our Lord Jesus, please continue helping us, giving us the vision to do things. Please bring growth to our denomination, in the congregations, pastors to be mature, to delegate, to put in practice what we have been receiving and your Spirit in us, guiding us through these challenging times, difficult times But with your help and your presence among us, we are very confident that we will continue growing and existing. We ask these things to you, our Lord Jesus, our Savior. Amen. Amen.

[00:31:17] Cara: Amen. Thank you all so much, and until next time, keep on living and sharing the gospel.


We want to thank you for listening to this episode of the GC Podcast. We hope you have found value in it to become a healthier leader. We would love to hear from you. If you have a suggestion on a topic, or if there is someone who you think we should interview, email us at info@gci.org. Remember, Healthy Churches start with healthy leaders; invest in yourself and your leaders.

Gospel Reverb – Into the Wilderness w/ Brad Turnage

Video unavailable (video not checked).

Join us this month as we welcome our guest, Brad Turnage. Brad is the Director of Youth and Family Ministries at Westminster Presbyterian Church in Charlotte, NC. He has worked in youth ministry for nearly 20 years and has served alongside his wife, Jamie, since 2009. They both feel a deep calling to work with teenagers and their families and are committed to walking alongside both as they come to understand the deep love God has for them in Christ.

With our host, Anthony Mullins, Brad reflects on the February 2024 sermon pericopes.


February 4—Fifth Sunday after Epiphany
1 Corinthians 9:16-23, “For the Sake of the Gospel”

February 11—Transfiguration Sunday
Mark 9:2-9, “Transfiguration Glory”

February 18—First Sunday of Easter Prep/Lent
Mark 1:9-15, “Into the Wilderness”

February 25—Second Sunday of Easter Prep/Lent
Mark 8:31-38, “The Way of the Cross”


If you get a chance to rate and review the show, that helps a lot. And invite your fellow preachers and Bible lovers to join us!

Follow us on SpotifyGoogle Podcast, and Apple Podcast.

Program Transcript


Into the Wilderness w/ Brad Turnage

Welcome to the Gospel Reverb podcast. Gospel Reverb is an audio gathering for preachers, teachers, and Bible thrill seekers. Each month, our host, Anthony Mullins, will interview a new guest to gain insights and preaching nuggets mined from select passages of Scripture in that month’s Revised Common Lectionary.

The podcast’s passion is to proclaim and boast in Jesus Christ, the one who reveals the heart of God, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. And now onto the episode.


Anthony: Hello friends and welcome to the latest episode of Gospel Reverb. Gospel Reverb is a podcast devoted to bringing you insights from Scripture found in the Revised Common Lectionary and sharing commentary from a Christ-centered and Trinitarian view.

I’m your host, Anthony Mullins, and it’s my delight to welcome our guest, Brad Turnage. Brad is the director of youth and family ministries at Westminster Presbyterian Church in Charlotte, North Carolina. And he has worked in youth ministry for nearly 20 years and has served alongside his wife, Jamie, since 2009.

And they both feel a deep calling to work with teenagers and their families and are committed to walking alongside both as they come to understand the deep love of God, which he has for them in Christ. And in his free time, Brad loves traveling (amen), photography, darts (hey, Ted Lasso), and disc golf.

My friend, thank you for being with us. Welcome to the podcast. And since this is your first time on Gospel Reverb, we’d love to know a bit about your story and how you are participating with the Lord these days.

Brad: Yeah, I have worked with teenagers pretty much just about every year of my adult life—different churches. And also spent a few years working with Young Life.

And I keep trying to do other things, but God just keeps bringing me back to working with teenagers. And I think really, it’s just such a hard kind of season of life. And especially for our kids that are growing up in the church and trying to find that space to honestly figure out, what is it that I believe? And is God real? And I just really come to life getting to walk alongside these students who are coming in and out of the great love of their Father.

But over the last few years, I’ve really more so been drawn to working with families. The best youth ministry happens at home. And so, I love going into family’s homes spending time, not just with students, but with their parents. Students and parents together, just helping our parents figure out how they can navigate this terribly difficult thing called adolescence. That is just as difficult for parents as it is for our young people.

And so, I’m blessed that I’ve been able to do that pretty much my whole life, and my wife is a great partner in that she makes me a better servant of the Lord as she serves alongside me. So just so thankful. And currently I’m doing that in Charlotte, North Carolina at Westminster Presbyterian Church, and I’ve been here for about a year and a half.

[00:03:27] Anthony: Yeah. I so appreciate what you said as someone who has served in youth ministry for a couple of decades myself. I don’t think I’ll ever leave that behind, right? Yeah, it’s like you said, you’re trying to do other things, but God keeps drawing you back to the way he’s made you.

And thank you for your love for Christ and the love for the family. And that’s encouraging because I think one of the biggest mistakes I’ve made in youth ministry was trying to segment the teens away from their families. Not intentionally, but some of the activities and the way we went about our ministry did that. So, it’s good to see that holistic approach.

As I mentioned at the top, Brad, this podcast is devoted to sharing commentary on the scriptures from a Christ-centered and Trinitarian view. That says a lot, but what does that say from your perspective? What does it mean to read Scripture in a Christ-centered and Trinitarian way?

[00:04:25] Brad: I would say two things to that. First, I think it just starts with an understanding that the entire Bible is one story. It is the story of how God will bring about his kingdom through the life, the death, and the resurrection of Jesus. So, no matter what you’re reading, that is the backdrop. That is the story—even if it’s before Jesus shows up on the scene. And of course, John reminds us that he was there from the beginning, that Word of God from the beginning. And so, I think having a Christ-centered view of reading Scripture is everything you read is through that lens.

And for me, practically how that I try to prepare myself to do that is I just live in the Gospels. Somebody told me several years ago, every month reread a Gospel, and I don’t do it quite that often. But I’m constantly reading the Gospels as I’m reading the Old Testament and Paul’s letters just as a reminder that everything I’m reading is about this person, Jesus.

And the next thing I would say is I would quote Karl Barth and say that Scripture is a witness to the Word of God, that Word of God, Jesus, as John 1 says. And not only a scripture witness to the Word of God, but because of the Holy Spirit that is active today, even now as the Spirit moves through those words of Scripture, it becomes the word of God here and now.

And so, you’ve got the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit so active in Scripture, and when we come to it, we have this opportunity, not just to learn about Jesus, but to be in relationship, to be in his presence. One thing I tell our students over and over again is if you want God, if you want Christ and Jesus and all of this to become real in your life, you got to read Scripture.

You have got to start with reading Scripture. It really is a living word of God today. And so that’s what I would say in terms of what it means to have a Christ-centered and Trinitarian kind of view of Scripture.

[00:06:30] Anthony: I was struck, Brad, by the fact that you said this is what it looks like in part to be in relationship with God.

Can you tell us more about that, what you mean? How do we come to scriptures when they’re just words on a page and it can feel flat and unalive? How does that enter into relationship?

[00:07:11] Brad: I think it’s a mystery. I can’t explain it. But I believe it because of my own life and pretty much everybody that I’ve ever talked to that have said, the time in my life that God really became real, and I felt that presence and I felt like I was in relationship with him was after I really took serious reading Scripture.

And I think the words are flat. But the practice of reading Scripture, I think, any practice when you start doing something. And if you want to run a marathon and you begin practicing, it’s challenging, it’s hard, but any practice, the more you do it, the more you come to life and the more that what you’re doing becomes easier.

And I think that just committing to reading Scripture is the only way to discover that mystery of there’s something about those words that are different. There’s something about the Bible that’s different. And I do think that all of Scripture is so important, but again the only way for the Old Testament to come to life is by knowing the one that it’s pointing to is Jesus Christ.

And so again, I think that’s why it’s so important just to live in the Gospels as we’re reading everything else.

[00:08:06] Anthony: Well, said, sir. All right.

Let’s do this. Here are the lectionary passages we will be discussing today.

1 Corinthians 9:16-23, “For the Sake of the Gospel”

Mark 9:2-9, “Transfiguration Glory”

Mark 1:9-15, “Into the Wilderness”

Mark 8:31-38, “The Way of the Cross”

Our first pericope of the month is 1 Corinthians 9:16-23. I’m going to be reading from the New Revised Standard Version, the updated edition, which is the Revised Common Lectionary passage for the fifth Sunday after Epiphany, which is February 4.

If I proclaim the gospel, this gives me no ground for boasting, for an obligation is laid on me, and woe to me if I do not proclaim the gospel! 17 For if I do this of my own will, I have a wage, but if not of my own will, I am entrusted with a commission. 18 What then is my wage? Just this: that in my proclamation I may make the gospel free of charge, so as not to make full use of my rights in the gospel. 19 For though I am free with respect to all, I have made myself a slave to all, so that I might gain all the more. 20 To the Jews I became as a Jew, in order to gain Jews. To those under the law I became as one under the law (though I myself am not under the law) so that I might gain those under the law. 21 To those outside the law I became as one outside the law (though I am not outside God’s law but am within Christ’s law) so that I might gain those outside the law. 22 To the weak I became weak, so that I might gain the weak. I have become all things to all people, that I might by all means save some. 23 I do it all for the sake of the gospel, so that I might become a partner in it.

Brad, I’ve heard it said that there’s a fine line between preaching with conviction and preaching with arrogance. And I think the fine line is humility. Paul writes, there’s no ground for boasting in the proclamation of the gospel. Tell us about that. What does he mean?

[00:10:20] Brad: I think there’s no place for boasting because the gospel begins with our death, and dead people have nothing to boast about. What is a dead person going to boast about? That you’re more dead than the next guy? That you’re better at doing absolutely nothing of any real value? And I think more than anybody, Paul understood that, especially coming from his old life that was blatantly sinful, right?

We all have that same darkness, but for Paul, he couldn’t deny it. He had this history, and he knew that any hope he had was that his life was now given to him in Jesus. In Galatians 2:20 he says, I’ve been crucified along with Christ. The life I now live I’m only living through the faith of the Son of God who gave himself for me.

There’s no boasting because you didn’t do anything and all you can do is hope that if you’re dead enough, someone else will resurrect you. And I think that’s what Paul means. And ironically the one thing that Paul does allow himself to boast about is the fact that he’s weak enough not to get in the way of what Jesus is doing in his life, that Jesus is his life.

And if we can just get out of the way, then then we get to participate in that. And so, I think it is this starting point of, our life has no value aside from the one that has filled us through Jesus Christ with this new self. So, I think that’s why Paul says there’s no boasting.

There’s nothing to boast about. You didn’t do anything.

[00:12:02] Anthony: That’s such a good perspective. And that reminds me of Robert Capon, and I’m quoting loosely here, but he talked about Lazarus coming out of the grave. What else was he going to do? Life himself told him to come forth, and he came forth. And that’s, I think, a metaphor for all of us, is it not?

[00:12:20] Brad: I think so. But again, you’re going to hear me say the words upside down and backwards a lot today. It is that mystery that the only way to life is in our death. And ultimately, that is true. That day that we pass on in our death, we come into the fullness of life and the kingdom.

But it’s also true right now that when we learn to die to ourself and we learn to let go, we allow for Christ to come to life. And that letting go that dying to ourself is such an important part of the Christian life. And I think you were right on when you said that fine line between preaching with conviction and preaching with arrogance is humility.

I think the harder question is how do we find that humility? Especially, preaching is such a terribly challenging job to stay humble because you’re literally standing on a pedestal in front of everybody. And people tell you how great you are, and people tell you.

For me, the pathway to humility is just being really honest about my own darkness. Years ago, I was preparing a talk on the Good Samaritan, and I was talking to my pastor, and he said the most important part of the Good Samaritan is that it reminds us that we have the ability to see somebody as less than human.

And I thought, no way. But the more that I just get honest about my sin, the more I see there’s some real darkness and there’s some real brokenness that is in my heart through my old self. And my old self is still a ghost that’s trying to cause problems. And the more I’m honest about my sin with myself, the more I hear the voice of God say, and yet I do not condemn; you now go and do likewise.

I think that’s how you are able to preach with boldness without it turning into boasting is if you’re just really honest about the fact that you’ve got nothing to give outside of Christ in you because of that old self that still ghosts around. But we try to let it go so that the new self will do what it does, and that is point to Jesus.

[00:14:47] Anthony: Yeah, I’ve been rereading a book by Eugene Peterson called Working the Angles and he talked about how the community of faith is a community of sinners and one of those sinners happens to be called pastor or preacher. That puts it in perspective. I’m just the one that, for whatever reason, the Lord is speaking a word but it’s his word.

And I have been raised to new life in him because I was dead, and I had nothing to do with it. So yeah, well said.

Paul really makes the point, leans into the fact that he’s trying to be all things to all people. And so, when you exegete a passage like this, I think the question has to be asked, what does it look like to be a slave to all, Brad? Help us. What does that look like?

[00:15:42] Brad: Yeah, good luck with that one. Slave to all. Is there a harder calling? It’s just everything, giving away of everything to all. I’m not there yet, but I continue on, trying to take hold of the one who has taken hold of me in Jesus.

And I think it starts with having a paradigm shift that you have really died with Christ and the life you now live is in Christ. It’s not yours. You are a new creation bought and paid for by the blood of someone else. And not only have you been bought with a price, the one who bought you has given you away to the world for the sake of the world. That is our calling.

In the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus says, Be the salt of the earth. Preserve that image of God in this world, be the light of the world. You are the light of the world to be this reflection of God in the world for the sake of the world. And I think one of the things about modern Christianity, at least here in the West, is that we don’t talk enough about what our role is in the world.

And that it’s to live for the sake of the world to be the image of God in the world. God in Christ made himself a servant, and he gave himself away to all and his life is now our life. And so, we have that same calling. The calling to give your life away. And the crazy thing is that the hardest thing is that it’s not just for the believers around us, but it’s for those who don’t believe, and it’s not just for those who love you, but it’s also for those who hate you. To make yourself a slave to all, as Paul says to, starts with this realization that our life isn’t ours to begin with.

And of course, it’s easier said than done. But coming to an understanding of that, I think has to be the start. And again, that’s upside down and backwards, but most anything in the gospel is going to feel that way.

And then if I were going to say, practically, how do we live that out, this idea of being a slave to all? I talk about two things. I’d say, first is you got to figure out the places that you’re already a slave. Because you can’t be a slave to all and a slave to something else that has you, that’s controlling you.

So be really honest. Where are the places in your life that you’re a slave? And start figuring out how to let some of those things go. You can’t hold onto two things at once. What are those things that demand our attention and demand our obedience? Ask God to help you see those things and then to have the faith through Christ to let those things go.

And then I’d also say that if you want to be a slave to all, you have to start small. You can’t be a slave at all before giving your life away to some. So, what does that mean with your family? What does that mean for the people around you? If you can’t give your life away to your wife and to your neighbors, you’re not going to do it “to the all” that Paul calls us to. So much of that is just putting other people’s interest above yours.

And it’s a great tool for ministry. And it’s something that in youth ministry, I’ve really seen God use. Coming along somebody and learning to love what they love is a great way of being in relationship, in sharing Christ with somebody. I had a student several years ago that I had been trying to connect with, and I just never could really get him to lean in. It just felt every time I tried to talk to him, I was hitting a wall. But I found out from his mother that he was a big fan of this TV show that was on Netflix. And one weekend, I just binge watched the entire show. And then I learned to love what he loved. That was the starting point of coming alongside of him for a couple of years and really getting to share Christ and Christ’s love and to be loved back by him and to see Christ in him.

I think that’s what it means. It’s just this perspective change that it’s not all about you. And it can’t be all about you because again, you’re dead and the one that is your life is the king of giving it all away, the king of being the slave for all. The more we understand that the more we can find little ways to do it.

[00:20:29] Anthony: Friends, we just had church. Brad was our teacher. Thank you. That was rich and challenging at the same time, especially in our culture where it is all about me. And it’s not. But that’s the way we try to live, and there’s a reason it doesn’t end well, right? It’s not the way it was meant to be. Thank you, Jesus, that you were the servant of all.

Let’s pivot to our next passage of the month. It’s Mark 9:2-9. It is a Revised Common Lectionary passage for Transfiguration Sunday on February the 11th. Brad, would you read it for us, please?

[00:21:09] Brad:

Six days later, Jesus took with him Peter and James and John and led them up a high mountain apart, by themselves. And he was transfigured before them, and his clothes became dazzling bright, such as no one on earth could brighten them. And there appeared to them Elijah with Moses, who were talking with Jesus. Then Peter said to Jesus, “Rabbi, it is good for us to be here; let us set up three tents: one for you, one for Moses, and one for Elijah.” He did not know what to say, for they were terrified. Then a cloud overshadowed them, and from the cloud there came a voice, “This is my Son, the Beloved; listen to him!” Suddenly when they looked around, they saw no one with them any more, but only Jesus. As they were coming down the mountain, he ordered them to tell no one about what they had seen, until after the Son of Man had risen from the dead.

[00:22:06] Anthony: So, Brad, the liturgical calendar gives us Transfiguration Sunday every year. Why do we keep telling this story? What’s the big deal here?

[00:22:16] Brad: It’s the biggest deal. If I could choose any moment in Jesus’ life to go back and be a part of and see it’s without question, the transfiguration. It’s the moment of all moments, I think, in the entire Bible, at least of the moments that have already happened. It seems like there are going to be some really big moments coming later, but in terms of what’s happened, it’s the moment.

Because if we think about Jesus’ life, including his miracles, if we could watch them, I think we’d find them to be more mundane than we expect. There was no smoke and lights. There wasn’t this hoopla and probably from our perspective, nothing that seemed super spiritual. He used mud to wipe away a man’s blindness. That’s incredible, but it’s not a show. And you can probably walk away from that, convincing yourself, was that man really blind after all?

But the transfiguration, there’s nothing mundane about it. It’s the moment in the gospel that the curtain hiding the mystery of Christ is pulled back. And for a moment, the disciples see what they had been trying to come to terms with, this reality that Jesus is really God’s Son. He is God in the flesh bathed in the light, that he is bathed in this glory. And none of the gospels really matter if Jesus isn’t God in the flesh.

If Jesus isn’t God in the flesh, then what’s the point? There were a lot of people that did really good things. There were a lot of people that did the things Jesus did but only one of them was God in the flesh. I think that’s why it is so important. It is just that moment that tells us Jesus really is who he says he is.

[00:24:09] Anthony: He tells us that. But his good buddies, like Peter, missed the point of what was happening. Or at least they were so overwhelmed by what they were experiencing, they didn’t know what to do with it.

I’m just curious and I know this is a leading question, but can we miss the point too? Because they wanted to stay up there on the mountain, and Jesus is like, no we’re going down the mountain and there’s work to be done. What can we take from this, Brad?

[00:24:39] Brad: Poor Peter. He misses the point. But Anthony, what are you supposed to say? I think the only thing you can ever really say that gets the job done is just thank you. And then you just shut up.

I think that’s the only thing Peter could have said in that moment. Thank you, God that we’re here. None of the disciples knew what to say. Peter just proved that fact by trying to say something.

But as for the mountaintop, yeah, I think we miss it all the time. And back to what we were talking about earlier. I think it’s because of this paradigm shift that life really is from our perspective, upside down and backwards. Of course, we want to stay on the mountaintop. Of course, the mountaintop is where we assume that we’re meant to live.

We have to recognize why we have these mountaintop experiences and what they’re for. I think God gives us these mountaintop experiences so that we might actually trust when he says the really hard things like, take up your cross and follow me, when he tells us to give our life away. And that the only way you’ll actually find your life is by losing your life. If all we have is that? Without the mountaintop, then how do you do it? How do you live the challenging life of giving yourself away to others, aside from these moments where you get to really experience God and his glory?

And those moments are beautiful. And I actually think it’s a lot like the miracles that Jesus performs. And we really want Jesus to be the miracle worker. Of course, 2,000 years ago when Jesus showed up, they wanted God to be the miracle worker who goes around taking care of all of our problems, healing the sick, feeding the poor, but that’s not who Jesus is.

He does these miracles so that we might believe him when he talks about the real mysterious way that he’s going to save us. Think about it. He feeds 5,000 people with this amazing miracle. But then immediately after that, he says, but I am the real bread that will give you life and whoever comes to me will never be hungry again.”

If Jesus would have just started with. I am the real bread of life. People would have been like, what? What he’s talking about? But once Jesus feeds 5,000 people with a few loaves, you go, Oh maybe I should pay attention to what he says. He gives these miracles.

It’s the same way with the raising of Lazarus, right? He raises Lazarus from the dead, but moments before that, he says the real miracle, which is I am the resurrection and anybody who believes in me will never die. How do you believe that? Jesus says, all right, I’ll give you this raising of Lazarus so that you might actually believe the real miracle—that is that nobody who believes in me will ever die.

I think that the mountaintop is like that. The Christian life is hard, and it’s mysterious, and it’s upside down and backwards. So, to give us the faith to do it, God gives us these moments. But we don’t live there as much as I’d like to. It’s just not where life is.

We read Scripture. We learn about this mystery of God who includes us in his life, death, and resurrection, who says, trust me and follow me, and you will find life when, like me, you give yours away. And that’s hard to believe and even harder to do.

And we’re given these mountaintops, whether that’s a camp or at a conference, whether it’s through the Spirit when you’re praising or singing. Maybe it’s through experiencing a real miracle, seeing someone healed after you pray. But we’re not meant to live there. We’re meant to follow Christ into the valley of the shadow of death, trusting that the only way we’ll ever experience real life is through losing ours.

[00:28:47] Anthony: It makes me wonder if scarcity is also behind this desire not to go down the mountain. We’ve experienced the brilliance of God here, but will we experience the brilliance of God in the mundane. I think the communion table teaches us, we do in just the common, ordinary, what might seem mundane, like bread, wine. It’s always present. And I think we do that with a worship gathering too. We think sometimes we’re coming into the presence of God. And really what we’re doing is asking the Spirit to grow our awareness of the presence of God already there and already everywhere we go. Even as we come down the mountain, God’s there. He’s at work. Grow our awareness, Lord. Right?

[00:29:36] Brad: Yeah. And I think communion is such a great picture of that because he takes the most mundane things that the disciples would have seen every day. There’s not a single day that they’re not breaking bread. So, Jesus didn’t use this illustration of this great banquet. He took the most mundane thing and said, every day when you’re breaking this, I’m a part of that. I’m a part of not just the high, but I’m a part of the very low. And it’s beautiful.

I think what happens when we come to the table enough to experience that bread and the body and the blood of Christ? What happens if we do it enough that every time we sit down at a table to enjoy a meal, we’re reminded that God is present even here in every moment of our life?

Yeah, it’s hard to believe because it feels mundane, and we just assume that God isn’t mundane. But he’s just everything! So of course, even in the mundane, he’s a part of that.

[00:30:38] Anthony: Amen. Hallelujah. Let’s move to our next pericope of the month. It’s Mark 1:9-15. It is the Revised Common Lectionary passage for the first Sunday of Easter Prep / Lenten Season, which is February 18.

In those days Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee and was baptized by John in the Jordan. 10 And just as he was coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens torn apart and the Spirit descending like a dove upon him. 11 And a voice came from the heavens, “You are my Son, the Beloved; with you I am well pleased.” 12 And the Spirit immediately drove him out into the wilderness. 13 He was in the wilderness forty days, tested by Satan, and he was with the wild beasts, and the angels waited on him. 14 Now after John was arrested, Jesus came to Galilee proclaiming the good news of God 15 and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God has come near; repent and believe in the good news.”

So, Brad, if you were preaching this text, what would you say? How would you herald the gospel?

[00:31:45] Brad: I think you have to at least, first, start with the Trinity, right? If I’m not mistaken, I think this is the only place in Scripture where we actually see the three persons of the Trinity interacting together in this way. The Spirit descends on the Son like a dove and the Father proclaims, You are my son.

And you have those three persons of the Trinity all interacting with one another. And whenever you can point to the Trinity, you have to do it. Because I think the Trinity shows us—I talk about this a lot with the students that I work with, good luck trying to understand the Trinity. And even more luck trying to talk about it because you can’t talk about the Trinity without stumbling into some heresy, here or there, just because it is so mysterious, and it’s so out of our kind of context of what we can understand.

But even though we can’t fully understand it, we can learn from it. And the most important thing I think we learned from the Trinity is that God is relational. And that’s crazy. That’s crazy that God is not only relational, but that he invites us into that relationship. And so, we see a Father who deeply loves his Son, and that love is flowing through the Holy spirit.

And I don’t understand it, but I know that God has said I’m included in it. And I’m so thankful that that same Spirit is a part of my life that helps me love the Father in Christ. You could build a sermon around that easily. I could talk for so long about that.

But I think I could also build a sermon—I might focus on the way that Jesus is sent into the wilderness before he begins his public ministry. It reminds us of those times in the Old Testament that the wilderness was used to prepare somebody for God’s work. Jacob goes into the wilderness and wrestles with God and then Israel is born.

Moses meets God in the wilderness before freeing the Israelites. And David wrote so many of his psalms fleeing from Saul in the wilderness. So, there’s something about the wilderness in Scripture that allows for God to show up in a meaningful way. I would probably focus in on that, on the wilderness.

[00:34:12] Anthony: As I’m thinking about your thoughts and trying to process what I’m hearing, I agree. If the Trinity is there, point out the Trinity! And this is where [Karl] Barth is so helpful to me. He gives us a language of talking about Trinitarian action. And he says we can’t comprehend it. All we can do is apprehend, get glimpses. And I appreciate the fact that you said we’re going to dabble in heresy here or there, not intentionally, but we will, because it’s a mystery! And Lord, fill us with wonder again. Sometimes we just make Christianity so flat.

So that leads us, as you said talking about the wilderness—and I do want to go there because … why? Okay, so Jesus hears these affirming words of the Father, these words that express the truth of his love. And the Spirit takes him to the wilderness right away? Come on, man, can’t we just ease into this before we go there.

So, tell us more about the wilderness because so much, as you’ve already pointed out, of Scripture we see happening in the wilderness. There’s a metaphor that maybe we don’t want to talk about and realize. What else would you say about it?

[00:35:30] Brad: Anthony, there’s no easing somebody into the wilderness, even if you would have said, all right, Jesus, you have a week, go to REI [Recreational Equipment, Inc – an American retail store], get yourself some gear. It’s still going to be tough. It’s the wilderness.

Plus, Jesus doesn’t get eased in anything. He shows up in a manger. That’s his moment of coming into this world. In some ways, Jesus going into the wilderness was this picture of him coming into our world, God in the flesh, this light in the darkness. But I do think it’s important to understand why Jesus, as he begins his public ministry, begins it with this time of struggle and this journey into the wilderness and this fasting.

And I don’t know to what extent Jesus needed to be prepared for his public ministry. And I’m certainly not going to try to figure that one out. But a journey that’s going to end in a cross might as well start in the wilderness, I think. Mark doesn’t give us much here, just that Jesus was tested by Satan.

In Matthew and Luke, we get a glimpse of just how Jesus was being tempted. I think it all has to do with how Jesus will use his power to fix the world. Robert Capon, who you mentioned earlier, talks about right-handed versus left-handed power. And right-handed power is the power to control, to coerce, the power to force. It’s what we think about as power in the world we live in.

But left-handed power is mysterious. It doesn’t look like power. It’s the power of forgiveness, power of patience, endurance, letting go. And ultimately, this is the power that we see used by God and Jesus Christ through his death and resurrection. I think the temptation of Jesus was the temptation to do a fix-up job on our broken world, to use his power to make a bad world good.

But it was never that way. It was always going to be his death and resurrection that would bring about his kingdom. The world doesn’t need to be made better. It needs to be resurrected. And it’s the same for us. It’s the mystery that is revealed to the disciples and hidden in the parables. This mystery of we find life and death, and we’re not going to find it anywhere else.

And so, I think that this temptation, even at the beginning of Jesus’s ministry as he goes into the wilderness, as he’s tempted, it feels upside down. It feels backwards. But again, God’s kingdom shows us that power doesn’t look like power, that the way that God is working in the world is not going to be the way that we expect.

And Jesus going into the wilderness is a little picture of that.

[00:38:22] Anthony: I have no doubt that there are those in our listening audience who feel like they’re in the wilderness right now. And we all are. Living in an evil age, it is wilderness. But for those that are exceptionally feeling that right now, what would you say to them? How would you encourage them?

[00:38:39] Brad: I actually think that those of us that feel like we’re living in the wilderness maybe have this blessing because it’s a reminder that we actually need. I worry about the people that don’t need God, or at least that’s the way they see their lives. There’s a gift of being in the wilderness and that is that if eventually we are reminded that the only hope we have is through someone else, then we can find that person.

I would say to those people, yeah, you’re in the wilderness, but you’re not alone. Christ is with you. And in fact, that is where James talks about when you’re—what does he say? That this testing brings about endurance. And I can’t remember exactly what he says in that first part of James, but the wilderness will change you.

And it will make you somebody that’s more like God, and more like Jesus Christ, the light of the world and who he’s called you to be, as well. And if you’re in the wilderness, maybe it’s because God is making you into somebody that can be the light of the world.

And that starts with trusting that he’s with you right there. But it’s hard. It is hard.

[00:40:04] Anthony: And maybe in another podcast, if we can get you back here and we talk about this passage of scripture, again. We’ll talk about the Spirit leading Jesus out. There are those Christians who think that God does things to them to teach them, to grow them up, to mature them in Christ, to reveal his presence. God’s a good God. He’s faithful, and he’s kind. Anyway, I’d love to have that conversation at some point. How deterministic is he?

[00:40:35] Brad: Yeah, I know. The one thing we do know is that God’s just really good at reconciling and resurrecting. So, I think we experienced God in those moments, and it feels [like] God made me go through this. But God’s just going to go ahead and resurrect anything that will die if we let go. And if we’re in that place and we really do let go and give ourselves away to Christ, that’s where we’ll find the resurrection. Because you can’t resurrect what isn’t dead! I think that’s why it feels like oh, God made me go through this so that I would experience this. But I don’t know I’m not going to try to figure out understanding all that.

[00:41:19] Anthony: But you can’t resurrect what isn’t dead. Let’s remember that.

All right. Our final pericope of the month is Mark 8:31- 38. It is the Revised Common Lectionary passage for the second Sunday of Easter Prep / Lent, which is February 25. Brad, do us the honors, please.

[00:41:38] Brad: Sure.

Then he began to teach them that the Son of Man must undergo great suffering and be rejected by the elders, the chief priests, and the scribes and be killed and after three days rise again. 32 He said all this quite openly. And Peter took him aside and began to rebuke him. 33 But turning and looking at his disciples, he rebuked Peter and said, “Get behind me, Satan! For you are setting your mind not on divine things but on human things.” 34 He called the crowd with his disciples and said to them, “If any wish to come after me, let them deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me. 35 For those who want to save their life will lose it, and those who lose their life for my sake, and for the sake of the gospel, will save it. 36 For what will it profit them to gain the whole world and forfeit their life? 37 Indeed, what can they give in return for their life? 38 Those who are ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation, of them the Son of Man will also be ashamed when he comes in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.”

[00:42:43] Anthony: Not today, Satan! Poor Peter. This is the second time in our conversation that we see him getting it wrong.

Let’s not waste it. What can we learn from this interaction with Jesus? And why did Jesus rebuke Peter so strongly? And what does that rebuke teach us about the ways of Christ?

[00:43:15] Brad: Before we talk about this rebuke of Peter—because it’s maybe the harshest thing Jesus ever says to Peter, and maybe he says to anybody. Get behind me, Satan.

But I want to give Peter credit. Literally just moments before this, Jesus gives Peter maybe the highest praise he’s given anyone in the Gospels. Just a few verses before Jesus says, get behind me, Satan is when Peter confesses Christ and Jesus says, yes, and this was not revealed to you by man, but by my Father. And from now on, Peter, I’m going to call you my rock, and I will build my church on you and the gates of hell will not keep it out.

I want to bring that up because I just love how Jesus lets the good be the good and the bad be the bad, right? He holds onto both of these things. So, in one moment that Peter gets it, he finds this beautiful response from Jesus. And the fact that Peter’s about to blow it, does it change what Jesus just said? And I think that’s so important because we go through our life and we have these moments where God calls us into his work and says, I’m going to do something with you. And then we blow it. And we’ve got to be able to, in those moments, shake it off and go all right, that doesn’t change what else Jesus has said and what else Jesus has called me to.

But this get behind me Satan that he says to Peter, I think it’s more than just calling out Peter. I think we have to go back to the wilderness, right? I think Peter’s doing exactly what Satan was doing to Jesus in the wilderness.

He’s trying to get Jesus to use his power in a different way. Peter’s saying, Jesus, you have the power to save the world without all this death and dying nonsense. That’s Satan. So, when Jesus says, get behind me, Satan, I think he’s talking to Satan more than Peter because what Peter’s doing is that same thing that we see Satan in the wilderness doing and trying to control the way that Jesus is going to change the world.

And Jesus is not going to have any of that because the only way to fix the curse of sin—Paul says the wages of sin is death. What we earn from our sin is death. The only way we’re going to fix it is through going all the way into that death and then resurrecting it.

And for Peter, there’s no way to saving the world that doesn’t involve Jesus’ death and resurrection. And we see that moment Jesus rebukes him, but I think it’s more this rebuking of what Satan is always trying to do, which is to have us not trust the real way that God is going to change the world and change us.

[00:46:04] Anthony: Yeah. And Peter’s going to give you a big old hug in the fullness of the kingdom for coming to his aid and reminding us that the good is good and the bad is bad.

And we all participate in it. That’s a good way of looking at it. Get behind me, Satan. So I’m looking at the verses 35 – 38, and in my mind, it’s filled with juxtaposition. Maybe you see it too. So how would you Christologically preach this portion of the text? What say you?

[00:46:35] Brad: I think Christologically, you just point to Jesus, because this is exactly how Jesus lived, right? He says those who want to save their life will lose it. Jesus loses his.

So, everything that Jesus is saying here that feels like juxtaposition (sorry, had a hard time saying that one) is because the kingdom really is upside down and backwards. And so, you point to Jesus, you point to all the ways that it’s upside down and backwards. You point to the fact that Jesus shows up in a time of history that he has such a small—in terms of at least globally—impact, right?

How far did Jesus travel from his home? Probably not as far as we’ll travel to visit family for Christmas. It’s upside down and backwards to think that’s the moment that God chooses to send his Savior into the world. You would have thought it would have been in a time where that person would be on TV, where that person would be able to get the message out in this big way.

You would have expected that it wouldn’t have been a—Jesus was basically a homeless man for the time of his ministry. That is upside down and backwards. The fact that Jesus says, love your enemies, the fact that Jesus forgives his enemies, even on the cross is so not the way that we would assume that any God of any taste would behave, but that’s the way our God is.

And so, what does that look like? It looks like giving away our lives and trusting that though it seems upside down and backwards, that really is the place where we’ll find life. And again, I think it’s because if we’re not doing that, then we’re not giving God the room to work. We’re not giving the Holy Spirit the space to do something meaningful because we’re holding onto that steering wheel and not letting go and letting him lead.

[00:48:48] Anthony: Yeah, and I’m looking at verse 38, Brad, and if I’m being real with myself, there’ve been times where I’ve been ashamed of Jesus and his words, especially out of my ignorance. And it says that the Son of Man will be ashamed. What do I take away from that? Where’s the good news there?

[00:49:10] Brad: So, in 38, “those who are ashamed of me and of my words.” I think in those moments, Anthony, I think you’ve got to, you got to just be really honest that you still have this duality of the old and the new. And the old self, we’ve died with Christ and in one sense, the old self is dead, but it’s a ghost. It has no future, but it’s still ghosting around.

And then the new self is the self that is really alive. And we live with both of these realities. I think that yeah, Jesus is [saying], your old self is the one that’s ashamed. And that’s why we have to put that old self away once and for all, and to disconnect the real you from the false you. And every day my old self makes himself known and but as I’ve gotten older, the more that I’m able to trust that that part of me is the part of me that when I’m dead is going to stay dead.

It’s not the real me. It’s the ghost of my old self. It’s the ghost of Adam. My life really is hidden in my new self, which is in Christ. It’s easy to think that our lives are this zero sum, that as I grow in faith, I become more righteous and less sinful and maybe the good Christian life is getting to 75 percent righteous and 25 percent sinful.

But the more I’ve been honest with myself, the more I think I’ve come to understand Scripture. The truth is my old self is 100 percent dead in sin. There is nothing of real life in my old self. The darkness is really dark. The evil is really evil. And my new self is 100 percent in Christ, resurrected and righteous.

And these two things they have nothing to do with one another, except that they’re both inside this person whose name is Brad. And so, when my old self kind of leads me into falling into sin or saying that thing, I just put it in its place and I’ll say, that’s not me. That’s not the real me and I think that’s what we have to do. I think in our death, once and for all, God will get rid of that old self in our death and then we really will be in the fullness of God’s creation made manifest.

[00:51:57] Anthony: Hallelujah that the lying Anthony won’t inherit the kingdom of God. That the one that was ashamed of Jesus’ words won’t inherit the kingdom of God. And I so liked the metaphor you use of ghosting. Wasn’t it Martin Luther that said, the old man was buried in the water, but I found out that old wretch can swim, and he keeps showing up in my life, right?

[00:52:20] Brad: And if we have time, I would love to tell you this story. One time I was teaching Colossians to a group of high school students. Colossians 3 has this language about the old self where it says, on account of these things, God’s wrath will be pulled poured out.

And I asked my students, I said, is there anybody that you would love to see God’s wrath poured out on? And they were like, no, how can you say that? And I said, there’s somebody in this room I would love for God’s wrath to be poured out on. And they were like, Brad, how can you say that? And I was like, yeah, and it’s me. At least it’s the part of me that is still struggling with sin.

It’s that old self I want God’s wrath to be poured out on my old self because if it’s not, and my old self gets into the kingdom once and for all, he’s going to ruin it for everybody else. As I live trying to follow Christ and that old self still gets in the way and still causes me to feel ashamed and question and get lazy and gets in the way of what God wants to do, yeah, bring your wrath on that part of me, God and kill it and let it stay dead forever. I’m okay with that.

[00:53:50] Anthony: I am too, brother. I have always enjoyed our friendship and your exegesis of Scripture. And this has just been a fun conversation, brother, around Scripture, something we both love. So, thank you for doing this.

And I also want to thank the team of people that make this podcast possible. We couldn’t do it without them. Reuel Enerio and David McKinnon and Elizabeth Mullins. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for your labor of love in service to Christ with Gospel Reverb.

And Brad, it’s our tradition to end with prayer. We’d love to ask you to do it, but thanks again for being a part of this. I really enjoyed it.

[00:54:30] Brad: Sure. And thank you for letting me just come here and talk about scripture and Jesus. I love being with you, Anthony, and I really appreciate what you’re doing here. So, let’s pray.

Father God, thank you that you’re the God that resurrects the dead, that you’re the God that brings new life, and that because of your life, death, and resurrection we can experience reality. We can experience your kingdom even here and now, Lord.

So, help us do just that, Lord. Help us learn how to die to ourselves. Help us learn how to let go of those things that we are giving our lives over to, Lord. And let go so that in Christ we might live for the sake of the world. And that the world might see you through your people, Lord.

So, use us to be your light in the world. Lord, use the people that are listening to this to be your light in the world, that their communities, that their workplaces, wherever they are, Lord, people might know you and experience your great love through them. We pray all this in your holy name. Amen.


Thank you for being a guest of Gospel Reverb. If you like what you heard, give us a high rating and review us on iTunes, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcast content. Share this episode with a friend. It really does help us get the word out as we are just getting started. Join us next month for a new show and insights from the RCL. Until then, peace be with you!

Sermon for February 4, 2024 – Fifth Sunday After Epiphany

Welcome to this week’s episode, a special rerun from our Speaking of Life archive. We hope you find its timeless message as meaningful today as it was when it was first shared.

Program Transcript


Speaking of Life 3011 | Loving Us Without Walking Away
Greg Williams

This is one of my favorite pictures. It hangs in my office and I see it every day. My son Gatlin was playing college football, and this is a post-game scene.

Gatlin played the position of linebacker and his primary role was to shut down the opponent’s ability to run the ball in the middle of the field. That afternoon the game wasn’t shaping up like we were hoping for. In particular, the other teams running backs were coming through the middle and breaking off long runs. It was as if the other team was reading our playbook. The bad news is that all afternoon they exploited the part of the field Gatlin was defending and our team suffered a decisive loss.

In this moment captured by the picture, my wife Susan walked alongside my boy in silence. She held that moment for him, saying nothing, just loving him without walking away. The picture reminds me of a passage in Isaiah.

He gives power to the faint, and to him who has no might he increases strength. Even youths shall faint and be weary, and young men shall fall exhausted; but they who wait for the Lord shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings like eagles; they shall run and not be weary; they shall walk and not faint. Isaiah 40:29-31 (ESV)

Perhaps the reason for this verse’s popularity is the weariness we can all identify with. Weariness of lost games and lost relationships, weariness of our own failures and the failures of those we love—fatigue in a fallen world.

That’s why this picture means so much to me. It’s my son having that existential experience of failure and his mother reaching out to stand up with dignity and grace beside him.

The Williams boys have their share of trophies and ribbons and championship rings—we did all that. But this picture is my favorite.
This is the tangible, never-ending love of God we meet in our weariness. Of Jesus—God with us—who not only experienced death but all the frustrations and the “nothing-to-say” disappointments of life as well.

Jesus never sinned, but he knew what it was like to have things go wrong. He had to learn to be a carpenter by way of hammered thumbs and uneven tables. Do we think of him that way? Do we think of him walking off the proverbial field with Mary by his side simply staying close?

He walks beside us. He suffers with us. He gives power to the faint and reminds us that love, joy, and grace—not defeat—will have the final word.

I am Greg Williams, Speaking of Life and reminding you that you never walk alone.  

Psalm 147:1-11, 20c • Isaiah 40:21-31 • 1 Corinthians 9:16-23 • Mark 1:29-39

This week’s theme is the service of God. In our call to worship Psalm, God is praised as creator and for his care of those who are nameless and forgotten. Isaiah 40 speaks of God empowering the powerless. In 1 Corinthians, we see Paul elaborate on the paradoxical nature of service and freedom required in preaching the gospel. The gospel reading in Mark recounts Jesus healing Simon’s mother-in-law who then got up to serve.

Preach or Bust

1 Corinthians 9:16-23 – ESV

Today’s text may seem to be an odd one for the Epiphany season. At first glance this text seems to give us more insight into the person of Paul than that of Christ. However, throughout this section Paul has made use of himself as an example to follow on the basis that he is following Christ. He will soon tell his readers to, “Be imitators of me, as I am of Christ” (1 Corinthians 11:1). From that perspective, we will look at this passage to give us some insight into the person of Christ, who is the gospel given to us. Paul is carrying out his calling to preach the gospel, which was given to him directly from Jesus himself.

Preaching was Paul’s calling. He makes it clear in the opening verses of our section that preaching is something he must do, not some optional career among other equal opportunities. Hear how Paul speaks of his calling to preach:

For if I preach the gospel, that gives me no ground for boasting. For necessity is laid upon me. Woe to me if I do not preach the gospel! For if I do this of my own will, I have a reward, but if not of my own will, I am still entrusted with a stewardship. What then is my reward? That in my preaching I may present the gospel free of charge, so as not to make full use of my right in the gospel. (1 Corinthians 9:16-18 ESV)

Paul wants the Corinthian church to understand that he is not preaching the gospel to get something for himself. He sees himself as compelled to preach and doomed if he doesn’t. As he puts it, “Woe to me if I do not preach the gospel.” He doesn’t see his preaching as a choice, but as a calling. For Paul, it is “preach the gospel or bust.” And the gospel he is preaching is the proclamation of the one who has called him—the Lord Jesus. Paul wants to be very clear that what he is doing cannot be controlled by others.

And that is a fitting point for him to be making to the Corinthian church. Paul had to write this letter to answer a whole series of arguments this church had challenged him with. Paul had previously answered the question concerning eating meats offered to idols, which the Corinthians had justified by their logical reasoning. Paul had to reorient their love of knowledge to take into account their love for other believers in their community. It seems that Paul’s challengers held themselves in high esteem and wanted to be in control of what they could and could not do. Why should they listen to Paul, or anyone else for that matter?

In that regard, Paul alludes to another issue these Corinthians had with him – his pay. Oddly enough, they were not arguing that they should not pay Paul for his services. On the contrary, they were frustrated that Paul would not take money from them like the other preachers normally did. What runs under this contention is the common etiquette in that society of patronage. It was an unspoken rule that those of high social standing would give money to those in need and by doing so the recipients would be obligated to give their donors honor. It appears the Corinthians wanted Paul to adhere to this social standard. By doing so they would think they would have some leverage over Paul. Paul does not want to be classified with others as a “philosopher for profit.” He really messed up their game plan of control by not accepting financial support from them. He knows that doing so would compromise his preaching to them. Paul is not in it for the money or anything else. He is carrying out his calling to preach the gospel.

What Paul seems to be painfully aware of is the fact that the gospel being preached is that Jesus is Lord, and these particular Corinthians were conducting themselves as if they were the only lord worth following. Not only was Paul preaching that Jesus was Lord, but he was conducting himself among them in such a way as to prevent them from lording it over Paul. And his challengers did not like it.

We may not have the patronage system in play in our society today, however, we too may see our societal systems and structures as taking precedent over God’s calling and word to us. How seriously do we grasp the gospel as Jesus being Lord? This means we are not. This means our society and culture is not. Perhaps we too want to control the message from the pulpit on account that we financially support it. Have you ever been tempted to withhold financial, or other support, when the message of the preacher strikes a little too close to home? We may not like to admit it, but we too like to be in control. But the message of the gospel is that we are not. The Lord is.

The message is good news because of who the Lord is. He is trustworthy and it is a very good thing that he is in control and reigning as Lord. The more we can come to see the Lord’s goodness, his faithfulness to us and his love for us, the easier it will be to lay down all our lording-over ways. We can easily become masters of manipulation to get what we want. Paul is aware of what is going on and more importantly, he is aware of what is at stake. This controlling attempt being expressed in the Corinthian church will be a hindrance for them to receive from the Lord. They are not living out of trust in him, but rather are trying to call the shots for themselves. Paul’s response? He is going to preach with no strings attached. He knows he cannot become indebted to them as he owes his life and existence to the one who has called him to preach. Let’s take note of how Paul’s allegiance to Christ alone frees him to fulfill his calling:

For though I am free from all, I have made myself a servant to all, that I might win more of them. To the Jews I became as a Jew, in order to win Jews. To those under the law I became as one under the law (though not being myself under the law) that I might win those under the law. To those outside the law I became as one outside the law (not being outside the law of God but under the law of Christ) that I might win those outside the law. To the weak I became weak, that I might win the weak. I have become all things to all people, that by all means I might save some. I do it all for the sake of the gospel, that I may share with them in its blessings. (1 Corinthians 9:19-23 ESV)

This sense of being compelled and indebted to the Lord leads him to unreservedly serve, not just his own people, but all people. He sees himself as free from the demands and expectations of everyone. And that makes him a bold preacher. He has nothing to lose, and the Corinthians have nothing to hold over him. In this way Paul knows he is free. So free that he can carry out his calling to anyone in earshot. He is not constrained by any particular people group or societal status. He can come alongside anyone and preach the gospel. He’s not threatened by someone who is different from him or goes by a different set of rules. This doesn’t mean that Paul is being duplicitous or inauthentic; he does not compromise on who he is in Christ or Jesus’ word to us. We are not to take Paul as an example of sinning with sinners in order to win them over any more than we would equate Jesus hanging out with sinners to mean he was sinning or condoning their sins. Paul does not take on their way of life, but he enters into their lives, where they are, in order to share with them who Jesus is and to share the blessings he has for them.

Running through Paul’s writing is the thought of servanthood. Paul has been freed by the gospel to be a servant to all. Even his resistance to the Corinthians’ attempts to control him is an act of service to them. True service is that which serves the gospel in the lives of others, even when it doesn’t lead to personal popularity. Paul is not trying to make friends; he is trying to share Christ. It’s not about him. In Greco-Roman society associating with the weak and being a servant would be counter-cultural and laughable. No one in their right mind would applaud the claim of becoming weak or a servant. Is our culture really any different today? Do we truly see service as an act of true freedom, or do we, like the Corinthian church, want to be in control, call the shots, and have the final say? Being weak in Paul’s era, as in ours, is not considered a virtue. We seek power and status, and rather disassociate with any who are considered “weak.”

Paul is imitating Christ. The gospel he preaches is the proclamation of the one who lowered himself to save us. Jesus did not come for his own advantage or to be popular and well liked. He came to do for us what we could not do on account of our weakness. He came to save us, and for that he got crucified.

The epiphany we can see in Paul’s message to the Corinthian church is that Jesus is compelled to be the Gospel for us, no matter the cost to himself. Jesus is Lord and he has no strings attached where we can control or manipulate him. And, when we come to see the goodness of God in Jesus Christ, we will not want to control him. We will be free to follow his call wherever he leads because he has proven to be trustworthy. We will be free to be for others even when they are not for themselves and fight against our efforts every step of the way. The freedom and devotion we see in Paul’s calling to preach the gospel comes from the one who is the Gospel, Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior.

Today’s text may be a poke in the eye for those of us who want our own control and say. It is a hard thing to die, too, but we must if we are to be free. The strings we try to tie to others are the same strings that are pulling on us. But Jesus sets us free. Here are some questions to consider.

  • How might we enter that freedom today in service to others in the gospel?
  • Who in your life needs to hear the good news of Jesus Christ, even as they fight against it?
  • Am I able to lose status for the sake of Christ?
  • Can I lay down my rights in order to gain a hearing from those who need some good news? In short, are we free to preach the gospel?

Paul’s calling is our calling as well. We may not preach like Paul or even stand behind a pulpit. But each of us preaches the gospel in word and deed by living a life devoted to Christ. That message often will not lead to being elevated on the cultural ladder of success. But, like Paul, we have been set free from such expectations. We have been lifted to the right hand of the Father. There are no strings attached. Live free. Serve all. Preach the gospel.

Into the Wilderness w/ Brad Turnage W1

Video unavailable (video not checked).

February 4—Fifth Sunday after Epiphany
1 Corinthians 9:16-23, “For the Sake of the Gospel”

CLICK HERE to listen to the whole podcast.


If you get a chance to rate and review the show, that helps a lot. And invite your fellow preachers and Bible lovers to join us!

Follow us on Spotify, Google Podcast, and Apple Podcast.

Program Transcript


Into the Wilderness w/ Brad Turnage W1

Anthony: Let’s do this. Here are the lectionary passages we will be discussing today.

1 Corinthians 9:16-23, “For the Sake of the Gospel”

Mark 9:2-9, “Transfiguration Glory”

Mark 1:9-15, “Into the Wilderness”

Mark 8:31-38, “The Way of the Cross”

Our first pericope of the month is 1 Corinthians 9:16-23. I’m going to be reading from the New Revised Standard Version, the updated edition, which is the Revised Common Lectionary passage for the fifth Sunday after Epiphany, which is February 4.

If I proclaim the gospel, this gives me no ground for boasting, for an obligation is laid on me, and woe to me if I do not proclaim the gospel! 17 For if I do this of my own will, I have a wage, but if not of my own will, I am entrusted with a commission. 18 What then is my wage? Just this: that in my proclamation I may make the gospel free of charge, so as not to make full use of my rights in the gospel. 19 For though I am free with respect to all, I have made myself a slave to all, so that I might gain all the more. 20 To the Jews I became as a Jew, in order to gain Jews. To those under the law I became as one under the law (though I myself am not under the law) so that I might gain those under the law. 21 To those outside the law I became as one outside the law (though I am not outside God’s law but am within Christ’s law) so that I might gain those outside the law. 22 To the weak I became weak, so that I might gain the weak. I have become all things to all people, that I might by all means save some. 23 I do it all for the sake of the gospel, so that I might become a partner in it.

Brad, I’ve heard it said that there’s a fine line between preaching with conviction and preaching with arrogance. And I think the fine line is humility. Paul writes, there’s no ground for boasting in the proclamation of the gospel. Tell us about that. What does he mean?

Brad: I think there’s no place for boasting because the gospel begins with our death, and dead people have nothing to boast about. What is a dead person going to boast about? That you’re more dead than the next guy? That you’re better at doing absolutely nothing of any real value? And I think more than anybody, Paul understood that, especially coming from his old life that was blatantly sinful, right?

We all have that same darkness, but for Paul, he couldn’t deny it. He had this history, and he knew that any hope he had was that his life was now given to him in Jesus. In Galatians 2:20 he says, I’ve been crucified along with Christ. The life I now live I’m only living through the faith of the Son of God who gave himself for me.

There’s no boasting because you didn’t do anything and all you can do is hope that if you’re dead enough, someone else will resurrect you. And I think that’s what Paul means. And ironically the one thing that Paul does allow himself to boast about is the fact that he’s weak enough not to get in the way of what Jesus is doing in his life, that Jesus is his life.

And if we can just get out of the way, then then we get to participate in that. And so, I think it is this starting point of, our life has no value aside from the one that has filled us through Jesus Christ with this new self. So, I think that’s why Paul says there’s no boasting.

There’s nothing to boast about. You didn’t do anything.

Anthony: That’s such a good perspective. And that reminds me of Robert Capon, and I’m quoting loosely here, but he talked about Lazarus coming out of the grave. What else was he going to do? Life himself told him to come forth, and he came forth. And that’s, I think, a metaphor for all of us, is it not?

Brad: I think so. But again, you’re going to hear me say the words upside down and backwards a lot today. It is that mystery that the only way to life is in our death. And ultimately, that is true. That day that we pass on in our death, we come into the fullness of life and the kingdom.

But it’s also true right now that when we learn to die to ourself and we learn to let go, we allow for Christ to come to life. And that letting go that dying to ourself is such an important part of the Christian life. And I think you were right on when you said that fine line between preaching with conviction and preaching with arrogance is humility.

I think the harder question is how do we find that humility? Especially, preaching is such a terribly challenging job to stay humble because you’re literally standing on a pedestal in front of everybody. And people tell you how great you are, and people tell you.

For me, the pathway to humility is just being really honest about my own darkness. Years ago, I was preparing a talk on the Good Samaritan, and I was talking to my pastor, and he said the most important part of the Good Samaritan is that it reminds us that we have the ability to see somebody as less than human.

And I thought, no way. But the more that I just get honest about my sin, the more I see there’s some real darkness and there’s some real brokenness that is in my heart through my old self. And my old self is still a ghost that’s trying to cause problems. And the more I’m honest about my sin with myself, the more I hear the voice of God say, and yet I do not condemn; you now go and do likewise.

I think that’s how you are able to preach with boldness without it turning into boasting is if you’re just really honest about the fact that you’ve got nothing to give outside of Christ in you because of that old self that still ghosts around. But we try to let it go so that the new self will do what it does, and that is point to Jesus.

Anthony: Yeah, I’ve been rereading a book by Eugene Peterson called Working the Angles and he talked about how the community of faith is a community of sinners and one of those sinners happens to be called pastor or preacher. That puts it in perspective. I’m just the one that, for whatever reason, the Lord is speaking a word but it’s his word.

And I have been raised to new life in him because I was dead, and I had nothing to do with it. So yeah, well said.

Paul really makes the point, leans into the fact that he’s trying to be all things to all people. And so, when you exegete a passage like this, I think the question has to be asked, what does it look like to be a slave to all, Brad? Help us. What does that look like?

Brad: Yeah, good luck with that one. Slave to all. Is there a harder calling? It’s just everything, giving away of everything to all. I’m not there yet, but I continue on, trying to take hold of the one who has taken hold of me in Jesus.

And I think it starts with having a paradigm shift that you have really died with Christ and the life you now live is in Christ. It’s not yours. You are a new creation bought and paid for by the blood of someone else. And not only have you been bought with a price, the one who bought you has given you away to the world for the sake of the world. That is our calling.

In the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus says, Be the salt of the earth. Preserve that image of God in this world, be the light of the world. You are the light of the world to be this reflection of God in the world for the sake of the world. And I think one of the things about modern Christianity, at least here in the West, is that we don’t talk enough about what our role is in the world.

And that it’s to live for the sake of the world to be the image of God in the world. God in Christ made himself a servant, and he gave himself away to all and his life is now our life. And so, we have that same calling. The calling to give your life away. And the crazy thing is that the hardest thing is that it’s not just for the believers around us, but it’s for those who don’t believe, and it’s not just for those who love you, but it’s also for those who hate you. To make yourself a slave to all, as Paul says to, starts with this realization that our life isn’t ours to begin with.

And of course, it’s easier said than done. But coming to an understanding of that, I think has to be the start. And again, that’s upside down and backwards, but most anything in the gospel is going to feel that way.

And then if I were going to say, practically, how do we live that out, this idea of being a slave to all? I talk about two things. I’d say, first is you got to figure out the places that you’re already a slave. Because you can’t be a slave to all and a slave to something else that has you, that’s controlling you.

So be really honest. Where are the places in your life that you’re a slave? And start figuring out how to let some of those things go. You can’t hold onto two things at once. What are those things that demand our attention and demand our obedience? Ask God to help you see those things and then to have the faith through Christ to let those things go.

And then I’d also say that if you want to be a slave to all, you have to start small. You can’t be a slave at all before giving your life away to some. So, what does that mean with your family? What does that mean for the people around you? If you can’t give your life away to your wife and to your neighbors, you’re not going to do it “to the all” that Paul calls us to. So much of that is just putting other people’s interest above yours.

And it’s a great tool for ministry. And it’s something that in youth ministry, I’ve really seen God use. Coming along somebody and learning to love what they love is a great way of being in relationship, in sharing Christ with somebody. I had a student several years ago that I had been trying to connect with, and I just never could really get him to lean in. It just felt every time I tried to talk to him, I was hitting a wall. But I found out from his mother that he was a big fan of this TV show that was on Netflix. And one weekend, I just binge watched the entire show. And then I learned to love what he loved. That was the starting point of coming alongside of him for a couple of years and really getting to share Christ and Christ’s love and to be loved back by him and to see Christ in him.

I think that’s what it means. It’s just this perspective change that it’s not all about you. And it can’t be all about you because again, you’re dead and the one that is your life is the king of giving it all away, the king of being the slave for all. The more we understand that the more we can find little ways to do it.

Anthony: Friends, we just had church. Brad was our teacher. Thank you. That was rich and challenging at the same time, especially in our culture where it is all about me. And it’s not. But that’s the way we try to live, and there’s a reason it doesn’t end well, right? It’s not the way it was meant to be. Thank you, Jesus, that you were the servant of all.


Small Group Discussion Questions

  • How did Paul view his calling to preach? What stood out to you about how he talked about his calling to preach?
  • It seems that the Corinthian church wanted Paul to accept their financial support so they could have some leverage over him. In what ways can you see that dynamic being played out today?
  • How would you describe true service?
  • How does knowing the Lord set us free from all other expectations that are set upon us?
  • In what ways can we preach the gospel even if we are not called to vocational preaching?
  • Discuss the temptation to gain status in our cultural surroundings that prevents us from boldly proclaiming Jesus as Lord.

Sermon for February 11, 2024 – Transfiguration Sunday

Program Transcript


In this season of Epiphany, we’ve seen the light of the world shining brighter, guiding us through the darkness. We’ve met the prince of peace, who brings calm to our turbulent lives.

With hearts aglow, we’ve embraced these truths. Our Savior, the embodiment of grace, has reached out to us with open arms to embrace all of humanity.

Today, we ascend to a metaphorical mountain. Picture it as a sacred place where heaven touches earth, a mountaintop of revelation. Here, in the presence of Jesus, we witness his radiant divinity.

Transfiguration Sunday marks the conclusion of Epiphany, transitioning us into a season of reflection and repentance, Easter Preparation. Our journey has unveiled the radiant character of God, seen in the love, grace, and compassion of Christ.

Just as the Transfiguration elevated Jesus on the mountaintop, it elevates our understanding. We see who we truly are in Christ. This profound revelation challenges us to embrace our divine identity.

As we stand at the precipice of this divine encounter, let us remember that our identity is woven into the very identity of Christ. We are called to radiate his love, grace, and compassion.

The Transfiguration is not an isolated event. It’s a continuous unveiling, a constant reminder of who Christ is and who we are in him. His glory transcends time and place.

Join us on this spiritual journey, where the light of the world continues to shine, and the transformative power of Christ’s radiant presence awaits.

Stay with us as we explore the significance of this moment, ready to embrace the glory of Christ that can change our lives forever.

Psalm 50:1-6 • 2 Kings 2:1-12 • 2 Corinthians 4:3-6 • Mark 9:2-9

This week’s theme is the transfiguration of identity. The Transfiguration story is echoed throughout all our readings for this special Sunday. In our call to worship Psalm, we are presented with God’s appearance that comes with fire and storm. 2 Kings 2 tells of Elijah’s glorious ascent to heaven providing some backstory to the Transfiguration where Elijah returns on the scene. Our reading from 2 Corinthians looks behind the veil where the face of Jesus Christ illuminates the glory of God. All these texts are gathered around Mark’s brief yet forceful account of the transfiguration of Jesus where his identity is put on full display, shedding light on our identity in him.

Jesus’ Glory Revealed

Mark 9:2-9 – ESV

Today is Transfiguration Sunday, which concludes the season of Epiphany and pivots us into the season of Lent, or what we call, Easter Preparation. The season of Epiphany is all about seeing God’s glory. It has been a season of seeing the mystery of God revealed in Jesus Christ. As we have looked at various stories and passages in Scripture during this season, we have been coming to see a little more fully who God is in his character and being. What was once hidden is now being made visible. And this unveiling, this revealing, this epiphany, leads us into the next season where we prepare for Easter by repentance – changing how we think to align and fit with what has been revealed to us in Jesus Christ.

Today, we conclude the Epiphany Season by revisiting the story of the Transfiguration as Mark tells it. Mark’s telling is much shorter and to the point. He does not want us to miss the significance of what is taking place. It is so significant that Mark has chosen to place it right in the middle of his gospel account, serving as a transition in the story. Like Jesus, Mark knows we need to see behind the veil to see who Jesus really is as the Son of God. Let’s take note of how Mark begins this dramatic story:

And after six days Jesus took with him Peter and James and John, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. And he was transfigured before them, and his clothes became radiant, intensely white, as no one on earth could bleach them. (Mark 9:2-3 ESV)

This story begins with “after six days” which triggers our expectations for another biblical culmination of glory so often displayed on the seventh day. And it becomes quite clear that Mark patterns this story after Moses’ experience of God on Mt. Sinai. You may find it beneficial to go back and read Exodus 24 and 34 to pick up on Mark’s parallels. Mark includes many of the elements such as the six days of waiting, the cloud, the glory, the voice, even the descent down the mountain. And who can miss the similarity of the shining of Moses’ face and the radiance of Jesus’ clothes?

Mark also chooses to place the story in the center of a section that runs from Mark 8:22-10:52. This section has bookends with the healing of a blind man at the start and then the healing of another blind man at the end. In between, however, the disciples are the ones who are truly blind. Three times Jesus predicts his death, but the disciples are never able to accept any concept of a Messiah associated with suffering and death. They are completely blind to seeing how a cross fits into their vision of a Messiah. As we see in Peter’s confession, he has the right words but the wrong meaning. A revelation is needed to heal the disciple’s own blindness to the identity of Jesus and his mission. So, between Jesus’ first announcement of his passion and the passion itself, Mark places the story of the Transfiguration. Mark knows that we also need a revelation of who God is as revealed in Jesus Christ in order to heal our blindness. When we are blind to the identity of Jesus, we will remain in the dark about our own identities as well.

We should take note that Peter, James and John were set apart for this special journey with Jesus. They must have felt privileged to be included in the trek up the mountain. Can you identify with the feeling of being included in a small circle? It can be a temptation to our pride for sure. Perhaps these disciples were feeling a bit more important than the other nine at this point. We all may have certain circles we would love to be included in. And if we ever find ourselves in a “special” circle we can become fearful of ever losing our status. We do not want to lose the “glory” we think we have attained for ourselves. We seem to always be looking for ways to elevate ourselves over others for our own sense of significance and security.

In contrast, we are given a witness of Jesus’ Transfiguration. Notice how Mark describes Jesus’ radiant clothes “as no one on earth could bleach them.” This glory is not a man-made one. It does not come by our ways of seeking and maintaining glory for ourselves. As we see Jesus transfigured, we see God’s glory—a revelation of who he is. In the Old Testament, glory was presented in terms of both a person and a light (Ezekiel 1). These two images come together here in the person of Jesus. Jesus radiating light reveals to us that our God, his Father, is quite unlike the pagan gods who need their worshipers to bring them glory as if they are lacking in certain ways. The God revealed to us by and in Jesus is self-sufficient and self-sustaining—like the sun. His life is a life of giving, going out, and bringing warmth and life. The God we see revealed in the transfigured person of Jesus is not a God who is turned inward—not one who needs the praise of humans, but rather a God of love who radiates life outward to his creation. God shares his glory with us, freeing us of clamoring to gain our own glory.

Now notice how the story records the response of these privileged disciples:

And there appeared to them Elijah with Moses, and they were talking with Jesus. And Peter said to Jesus, “Rabbi, it is good that we are here. Let us make three tents, one for you and one for Moses and one for Elijah.” For he did not know what to say, for they were terrified. And a cloud overshadowed them, and a voice came out of the cloud, “This is my beloved Son; listen to him.” And suddenly, looking around, they no longer saw anyone with them but Jesus only. (Mark 9:4-8 ESV)

It seems the appearance of Elijah and Moses offered a threat to their small circle of inclusion as “they were terrified” after the arrival of the dynamic duo. Would Jesus move on without them now that two superstars were on the scene? With his transfiguration can they trust that this is the same Jesus who came up the mountain with them? Maybe some of what they feared was being excluded after being so graciously included. Peter, keying off his fear, started running his mouth. He seems to be grasping for inclusion as if he was left out. He tries to include himself into the experience with “it is good that we are here.” Perhaps with an emphasis on the word “we.”

He also makes the suggestion of building “three tents” which treats Moses, Elijah and Jesus as equals. Peter is still blind to who Jesus is. Jesus has no equal. Peter’s suggestion to build tents would also be an act of controlling the experience. He wants to prolong his time in this elite group. You can’t stay on a mountain long without shelter. But Peter’s senseless talk and clamoring for inclusion is interrupted by a cloud that “overshadowed them” and a voice speaking directly to them, “This is my beloved Son; listen to him.” Jesus did not bring them up the mountain just to exclude them. They needed to see a deeper revelation of who Jesus is. They needed to see “only Jesus.” Moses and Elijah are gone.

It is also important to clarify that Jesus did not undergo some change on the mountain. The radiant Jesus on top of the mountain is the same Jesus who came from the foot of the mountain. The only thing that has changed is the disciples were able to get a glimpse of who this Jesus really is. Jesus’ Transfiguration is not a change in Jesus, it is a change in our seeing and knowing of who he is. Peter needed to see this in order to relax his grip on trying to attain his own glory. He and the other disciples are being prepared to understand that this Messiah’s glory does not exclude the cross. The cross was the most brutal act of exclusion that brought all the shame that we so desperately try to avoid. But Jesus will not avoid the cross. He goes there to include us in his life with his Father. In Jesus our identity is forever significant and secure.

How often do we seek our identity in some circle that promises glory? Is it that tight social circle of friends or associates that make you feel set apart or that exclusive club that will announce to the world how special we are? Maybe it’s just getting into the “right” school or job. Even churches can lead to endless running round in circles within circles looking for identity. But like Moses and Elijah these circles of importance quickly disappear once we find ourselves inside them. These circles are drawn with imaginary lines. Our true circle of identity is found only in Jesus. He has already included us in his life with the Father and Spirit. We will find all the inclusion and identity we ever need as we see “only Jesus.” This is the circle we are made for and in no way does the Father intend to exclude us from it. Let’s take notice of how Mark concludes the story:

And as they were coming down the mountain, he charged them to tell no one what they had seen, until the Son of Man had risen from the dead. (Mark 9:2-9 ESV)

The end of the story leaves us again with the three disciples and Jesus. We may have occasional mountaintop experiences with Jesus, but he doesn’t stand on the pinnacle looking down on us as we descend to the valley. He goes with us. As he walks with us in all aspects of our life, he is working to help us see who he is and who we are in him. No matter what “circle” we find ourselves in, we look to see only the Son as the Spirit continues to make us children of the Father. And this comes by way of repentance. Just as Jesus had to go to the cross before the disciples could fully understand God’s glory revealed on the mountain, we too must die to all that we cling to for our own glory. Glory is not what we make for ourselves, it is what we receive from the one who died for us. And that glory awaits us in Jesus who is “risen from the dead.”

As we ponder the significance of Jesus’ Transfiguration, I challenge you to relax your grip on trying to attain your own glory. Are there circles that are feeding your identity rather than “only Jesus?” Are there pursuits of “glory” that the Lord is calling you to leave at the cross? Today can be your day of transition from darkness to light, from blindness to sight. The Lord is glorious, and he invites you up the mountain with him. You won’t be the same on the way down.

Into the Wilderness w/ Brad Turnage W2

Video unavailable (video not checked).

February 11—Transfiguration Sunday
Mark 9:2-9, “Transfiguration Glory”

CLICK HERE to listen to the whole podcast.


If you get a chance to rate and review the show, that helps a lot. And invite your fellow preachers and Bible lovers to join us!

Follow us on Spotify, Google Podcast, and Apple Podcast.

Program Transcript


Into the Wilderness w/ Brad Turnage W2

Anthony: Let’s pivot to our next passage of the month. It’s Mark 9:2-9. It is a Revised Common Lectionary passage for Transfiguration Sunday on February the 11th. Brad, would you read it for us, please?

Brad:

Six days later, Jesus took with him Peter and James and John and led them up a high mountain apart, by themselves. And he was transfigured before them, and his clothes became dazzling bright, such as no one on earth could brighten them. And there appeared to them Elijah with Moses, who were talking with Jesus. Then Peter said to Jesus, “Rabbi, it is good for us to be here; let us set up three tents: one for you, one for Moses, and one for Elijah.” He did not know what to say, for they were terrified. Then a cloud overshadowed them, and from the cloud there came a voice, “This is my Son, the Beloved; listen to him!” Suddenly when they looked around, they saw no one with them any more, but only Jesus. As they were coming down the mountain, he ordered them to tell no one about what they had seen, until after the Son of Man had risen from the dead.

Anthony: So, Brad, the liturgical calendar gives us Transfiguration Sunday every year. Why do we keep telling this story? What’s the big deal here?

Brad: It’s the biggest deal. If I could choose any moment in Jesus’ life to go back and be a part of and see it’s without question, the transfiguration. It’s the moment of all moments, I think, in the entire Bible, at least of the moments that have already happened. It seems like there are going to be some really big moments coming later, but in terms of what’s happened, it’s the moment.

Because if we think about Jesus’ life, including his miracles, if we could watch them, I think we’d find them to be more mundane than we expect. There was no smoke and lights. There wasn’t this hoopla and probably from our perspective, nothing that seemed super spiritual. He used mud to wipe away a man’s blindness. That’s incredible, but it’s not a show. And you can probably walk away from that, convincing yourself, was that man really blind after all?

But the transfiguration, there’s nothing mundane about it. It’s the moment in the gospel that the curtain hiding the mystery of Christ is pulled back. And for a moment, the disciples see what they had been trying to come to terms with, this reality that Jesus is really God’s Son. He is God in the flesh bathed in the light, that he is bathed in this glory. And none of the gospels really matter if Jesus isn’t God in the flesh.

If Jesus isn’t God in the flesh, then what’s the point? There were a lot of people that did really good things. There were a lot of people that did the things Jesus did but only one of them was God in the flesh. I think that’s why it is so important. It is just that moment that tells us Jesus really is who he says he is.

Anthony: He tells us that. But his good buddies, like Peter, missed the point of what was happening. Or at least they were so overwhelmed by what they were experiencing, they didn’t know what to do with it.

I’m just curious and I know this is a leading question, but can we miss the point too? Because they wanted to stay up there on the mountain, and Jesus is like, no we’re going down the mountain and there’s work to be done. What can we take from this, Brad?

Brad: Poor Peter. He misses the point. But Anthony, what are you supposed to say? I think the only thing you can ever really say that gets the job done is just thank you. And then you just shut up.

I think that’s the only thing Peter could have said in that moment. Thank you, God that we’re here. None of the disciples knew what to say. Peter just proved that fact by trying to say something.

But as for the mountaintop, yeah, I think we miss it all the time. And back to what we were talking about earlier. I think it’s because of this paradigm shift that life really is from our perspective, upside down and backwards. Of course, we want to stay on the mountaintop. Of course, the mountaintop is where we assume that we’re meant to live.

We have to recognize why we have these mountaintop experiences and what they’re for. I think God gives us these mountaintop experiences so that we might actually trust when he says the really hard things like, take up your cross and follow me, when he tells us to give our life away. And that the only way you’ll actually find your life is by losing your life. If all we have is that? Without the mountaintop, then how do you do it? How do you live the challenging life of giving yourself away to others, aside from these moments where you get to really experience God and his glory?

And those moments are beautiful. And I actually think it’s a lot like the miracles that Jesus performs. And we really want Jesus to be the miracle worker. Of course, 2,000 years ago when Jesus showed up, they wanted God to be the miracle worker who goes around taking care of all of our problems, healing the sick, feeding the poor, but that’s not who Jesus is.

He does these miracles so that we might believe him when he talks about the real mysterious way that he’s going to save us. Think about it. He feeds 5,000 people with this amazing miracle. But then immediately after that, he says, but I am the real bread that will give you life and whoever comes to me will never be hungry again.”

If Jesus would have just started with. I am the real bread of life. People would have been like, what? What he’s talking about? But once Jesus feeds 5,000 people with a few loaves, you go, Oh maybe I should pay attention to what he says. He gives these miracles.

It’s the same way with the raising of Lazarus, right? He raises Lazarus from the dead, but moments before that, he says the real miracle, which is I am the resurrection and anybody who believes in me will never die. How do you believe that? Jesus says, all right, I’ll give you this raising of Lazarus so that you might actually believe the real miracle—that is that nobody who believes in me will ever die.

I think that the mountaintop is like that. The Christian life is hard, and it’s mysterious, and it’s upside down and backwards. So, to give us the faith to do it, God gives us these moments. But we don’t live there as much as I’d like to. It’s just not where life is.

We read Scripture. We learn about this mystery of God who includes us in his life, death, and resurrection, who says, trust me and follow me, and you will find life when, like me, you give yours away. And that’s hard to believe and even harder to do.

And we’re given these mountaintops, whether that’s a camp or at a conference, whether it’s through the Spirit when you’re praising or singing. Maybe it’s through experiencing a real miracle, seeing someone healed after you pray. But we’re not meant to live there. We’re meant to follow Christ into the valley of the shadow of death, trusting that the only way we’ll ever experience real life is through losing ours.

Anthony: It makes me wonder if scarcity is also behind this desire not to go down the mountain. We’ve experienced the brilliance of God here, but will we experience the brilliance of God in the mundane. I think the communion table teaches us, we do in just the common, ordinary, what might seem mundane, like bread, wine. It’s always present. And I think we do that with a worship gathering too. We think sometimes we’re coming into the presence of God. And really what we’re doing is asking the Spirit to grow our awareness of the presence of God already there and already everywhere we go. Even as we come down the mountain, God’s there. He’s at work. Grow our awareness, Lord. Right?

Brad: Yeah. And I think communion is such a great picture of that because he takes the most mundane things that the disciples would have seen every day. There’s not a single day that they’re not breaking bread. So, Jesus didn’t use this illustration of this great banquet. He took the most mundane thing and said, every day when you’re breaking this, I’m a part of that. I’m a part of not just the high, but I’m a part of the very low. And it’s beautiful.

I think what happens when we come to the table enough to experience that bread and the body and the blood of Christ? What happens if we do it enough that every time we sit down at a table to enjoy a meal, we’re reminded that God is present even here in every moment of our life?

Yeah, it’s hard to believe because it feels mundane, and we just assume that God isn’t mundane. But he’s just everything! So of course, even in the mundane, he’s a part of that.

Anthony: Amen. Hallelujah.


Small Group Discussion Questions

  • What are some of the parallels you can spot in Mark’s account of the Transfiguration and the story of Moses and Mt. Sinai? Do you see other Old Testament connections?
  • Discuss the statement made in the sermon, “When we are blind to the identity of Jesus, we will remain in the dark about our own identities as well.”
  • What does the metaphor of “radiant light” tell us about God’s glory?
  • What are some ways you can see where we are tempted to grasp our own glory? What circles do we try to belong to for our identity?
  • How does Jesus going to the cross expand our understanding of God’s glory?
  • Share any changes you see the Lord calling you to in response to the message.

Sermon for February 18 – First Sunday of Easter Preparation

Welcome to this week’s episode, a special rerun from our Speaking of Life archive. We hope you find its timeless message as meaningful today as it was when it was first shared.

Program Transcript


Speaking of Life 3013 | Rainbow’s Promise
Greg Williams

Do you remember the first time you saw a rainbow?

Rainbows are iconic, universal, showing up in legends and stories throughout history. Despite years of pollution and our increasingly busy lives, rainbows still make us stop…and look up.

The first recorded rainbow appears in Genesis 9, just after the flood recedes. Noah walks out into the steaming earth and hears the voice of God:

I have set my bow in the clouds, and it shall be a sign of the covenant between me and the earth. When I bring clouds over the earth and the bow is seen in the clouds, I will remember my covenant that is between me and you and every living creature of all flesh; and the waters shall never again become a flood to destroy all flesh.
Genesis 9:13-15 (NRSV)

This is what is called by theologians “The Noahic Covenant”—one of several agreements that God made with Israel—and by proxy all the world.

And here we see this strange imagery of the rainbow. “I have set my bow…” This word “bow” is the same Hebrew word as the bow of battle. To the original readers, the bow would have been a common sight in battle. It meant war and death.

But for God to “set his bow” meant that war was over, that the struggle was over. This is the sign of the rainbow in the clouds, turned away from us, a bow at rest.

That rest is what we remember when we see it. and it reminds us of all of life. As violent as the storm might be, the rainbow will be there—the power of the thunder and rain turns to beauty and color. That’s all that’s left standing.

The covenant reminds us that a devastation like a flood won’t destroy us again. God will not destroy us and start over; he will work with us and through us to accomplish redemption. He works through each storm in our lives to make beauty and light come through.

Instead of ending history, he works within it. And instead of starting over with humanity, he became one.

He set his bow in the sky. He set his covenant that he will always work with us and within us on our relationship with him. Let’s remember this promise when the storm comes.

I’m Greg Williams, Speaking of Life

Psalm 25:1-10 • Genesis 9:8-17 • 1 Peter 3:18-22 • Mark 1:9-15
This week, we celebrate the first Sunday of the Lent or Easter Preparation season. This is a time when we examine ourselves, seeking to prune the things that no longer serve us so God can grow new life. The theme for this week is God’s passionate presence. The Psalm speaks about God’s faithfulness and how he actively teaches and leads the humble. In the Genesis passage, we see God, using his own initiative, make a covenant with Noah and his descendants. In 1 Peter, the author describes how Jesus suffered and died for humanity. Finally, the Gospel passage recounts how God tore the heavens in order to make his presence on earth known.

The Heavens are Torn

Mark 1:9-15 NIV

If you ever watched one of the Law & Orders, CSIs, or any other crime drama made in America, the following scenes will be familiar to you. The audience observes someone commit a crime. We will call this person the Crook. The Crook somehow gets away. Maybe there was some kind of chase down an alley with a random fence in the middle of it that the Crook scales like they are some kind of monkey squirrel. Or maybe the Crook runs out into the street and makes it across while the good-looking-even-while-running detective pursuing the Crook gets hit by a car. Don’t worry. Despite being hit by two tons of metal, the detective is never seriously hurt. They just kind of bounce off the windshield. Either one of those two options is usually featured in the story (sometimes both). At any rate, the Crook gets away and hides in some dingy motel room or at an unwitting relative’s house. (Just so you know, Crooks only hide in dirty places. It’s apparently a rule.) Through some nifty police work, the detectives find out where the Crook is hiding and a SWAT team instantly appears outside the door. The armored SWAT team, led by the unarmored detective, proceeds to break the door down. There is a lot of yelling of things like “Police!” and “Freeze!” Mysteriously, the detectives never check to see if the door is unlocked. They just break the whole thing down. There is probably a rule about that as well.

Breaking a door down is dramatic (hence the term crime drama). When the detectives break the door down, it sends the message that their need is urgent. They are determined not to allow their quarry to escape and no obstacle will stop them. In real life, police do far more knocking on doors than kicking them down. However, a broken open door is much more compelling and entertaining for the uninvolved observer, which better serves the purposes of the show’s producers. It helps the audience understand the importance of the chase within the context of the story and become more invested in what happens to the characters. We can understand what it means when a detective kicks open a door. However, what does it mean when God breaks down a door? In essence, this is what happened at the baptism of Jesus. We can find the account in Mark 1:9-15:

At that time Jesus came from Nazareth in Galilee and was baptized by John in the Jordan. Just as Jesus was coming up out of the water, he saw heaven being torn open and the Spirit descending on him like a dove. And a voice came from heaven: “You are my Son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased.” At once the Spirit sent him out into the wilderness, and he was in the wilderness forty days, being tempted by Satan. He was with the wild animals, and angels attended him. After John was put in prison, Jesus went into Galilee, proclaiming the good news of God. “The time has come,” he said. “The kingdom of God has come near. Repent and believe the good news!” (Mark 1:9-15 NIV)

The first appearance of Jesus in Mark’s gospel could seem underwhelming. Matthew and Luke begin their accounts of the life of Jesus with a miraculous virgin birth accompanied by prophecies, angels, wise men, and a genocidal king. In one of the most beautiful writings in scripture, John’s account starts in a time before time. By paralleling the creation narrative, he immediately points to Jesus as Immanuel, God with us. John’s gospel then lines up with Mark’s — a discussion of John the Baptist followed by the baptism of Jesus. However, John includes the Baptizer’s protest, proclaiming his unworthiness to baptize his Lord. Matthew, Luke, and John make Jesus’ first appearance in their gospels auspicious. The audience is given the clear signs that Jesus is special. In Mark 1:9, we first encounter Jesus, a guy from a lowly regarded town, standing in the hot desert, waiting in line like a “normal.” No prophecies. No angels. No lofty prose. Jesus unremarkably receives a baptism that he should not need.

Then everything changed in verse 10. As Jesus came out of the water, the heavens — the boundary between the spiritual world and physical world — were torn open. They were not gently parted. They were not surgically cut. The fabric of space and time was ripped apart so that the frayed edges could not and cannot be mended. The baptism of Jesus not only signaled the official start of Christ’s earthly ministry, but it was a sign of God breaking into our world in a new way. Through the tear, God-the-Spirit entered our reality like a dove and alit on God-the-Son. God-the-Father could not contain his excitement and bellowed his love for Jesus. To Mark’s audience, tearing the heavens feels dramatic. When God tore open the heavens, he sent the message that his need was urgent. He was determined not to let his children escape and no obstacle would stop him. Mark wanted us to understand the importance of this chase within the context of the story and become more invested in what happens to the characters in his gospel.

For Mark, the most important thing he wanted his readers to know about Jesus, right from the start, was that Christ embodied God’s passionate pursuit of humanity. God’s desire for humanity was (and is) not careful and measured. God does not stoically observe us from a distance. God would tear apart heaven itself in order to save, redeem, and restore his children. His love for us has even been described as reckless.

Therefore, we should not wonder what compelled Christ to face the enemy right at the get go. After baptism, Mark says that Christ’s first act was to be led by the Spirit into the desert to prepare himself for ministry by spending time with his Father and to face the accuser of humanity on our behalf. Passionate protective love drove Jesus to face Satan on the enemy’s home turf — the realm of isolation, discomfort, and physical weakness. The Lord wanted to keep his children safe from the schemes of the Devil. Also, Jesus’ victory over the enemy was another way that he demonstrated that God would be present on the earth in a different way. This is part of the “good news” that Jesus started to proclaim at the end of today’s text. Our loving God has drawn near. He has torn the heavens in his zeal. He has confronted the enemy in his passion. The kingdom of God has been established on earth and it will never be stopped.

In this season of Easter Preparation, we make ready our hearts and minds to worship Christ, in whom we have new life, on Easter Sunday. In this season, we try to remove distractions and lean into spiritual practices to make ourselves more available to God. Some in the Christian community will practice abstinence, temporarily depriving themselves from something harmless (i.e. meat on Fridays), to remind ourselves to make room for God. Unfortunately, some see this season as a time of self-punishment in order to make ourselves acceptable to God. Some still see God as stern or distant and make Easter Preparation sad and serious. They believe that God is somehow pleased when we wallow in misery. Instead, it is fitting that we start this season with a reminder of God’s overflowing love for humanity. We prune our lives because we have been accepted and we want the reality of God’s presence to be more and more of our reality. Let our worship of God be motivated by his deep, abiding love for us.

The thing about broken down doors is that they are no longer useable. Once a door has been kicked in, a new door must be hung. When God tore open the heavens, he never repaired the breach. The heavens will remain torn until he makes a new heaven and a new earth. In that day, there will be no more need for the sun because God’s presence will light up all creation. Until that day, God continues to be present here with us. His passionate presence should fill us with joy and hope. This is good news worth sharing. This is the Gospel by which we should live.

Into the Wilderness w/ Brad Turnage W3

Video unavailable (video not checked).

February 18—First Sunday of Easter Prep/Lent
Mark 1:9-15, “Into the Wilderness”

CLICK HERE to listen to the whole podcast.


If you get a chance to rate and review the show, that helps a lot. And invite your fellow preachers and Bible lovers to join us!

Follow us on Spotify, Google Podcast, and Apple Podcast.

Program Transcript


Into the Wilderness w/ Brad Turnage W3

Anthony: Let’s move to our next pericope of the month. It’s Mark 1:9-15. It is the Revised Common Lectionary passage for the first Sunday of Easter Prep / Lenten Season, which is February 18.

In those days Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee and was baptized by John in the Jordan. 10 And just as he was coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens torn apart and the Spirit descending like a dove upon him. 11 And a voice came from the heavens, “You are my Son, the Beloved; with you I am well pleased.” 12 And the Spirit immediately drove him out into the wilderness. 13 He was in the wilderness forty days, tested by Satan, and he was with the wild beasts, and the angels waited on him. 14 Now after John was arrested, Jesus came to Galilee proclaiming the good news of God 15 and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God has come near; repent and believe in the good news.”

So, Brad, if you were preaching this text, what would you say? How would you herald the gospel?

Brad: I think you have to at least, first, start with the Trinity, right? If I’m not mistaken, I think this is the only place in Scripture where we actually see the three persons of the Trinity interacting together in this way. The Spirit descends on the Son like a dove and the Father proclaims, You are my son.

And you have those three persons of the Trinity all interacting with one another. And whenever you can point to the Trinity, you have to do it. Because I think the Trinity shows us—I talk about this a lot with the students that I work with, good luck trying to understand the Trinity. And even more luck trying to talk about it because you can’t talk about the Trinity without stumbling into some heresy, here or there, just because it is so mysterious, and it’s so out of our kind of context of what we can understand.

But even though we can’t fully understand it, we can learn from it. And the most important thing I think we learned from the Trinity is that God is relational. And that’s crazy. That’s crazy that God is not only relational, but that he invites us into that relationship. And so, we see a Father who deeply loves his Son, and that love is flowing through the Holy spirit.

And I don’t understand it, but I know that God has said I’m included in it. And I’m so thankful that that same Spirit is a part of my life that helps me love the Father in Christ. You could build a sermon around that easily. I could talk for so long about that.

But I think I could also build a sermon—I might focus on the way that Jesus is sent into the wilderness before he begins his public ministry. It reminds us of those times in the Old Testament that the wilderness was used to prepare somebody for God’s work. Jacob goes into the wilderness and wrestles with God and then Israel is born.

Moses meets God in the wilderness before freeing the Israelites. And David wrote so many of his psalms fleeing from Saul in the wilderness. So, there’s something about the wilderness in Scripture that allows for God to show up in a meaningful way. I would probably focus in on that, on the wilderness.

Anthony: As I’m thinking about your thoughts and trying to process what I’m hearing, I agree. If the Trinity is there, point out the Trinity! And this is where [Karl] Barth is so helpful to me. He gives us a language of talking about Trinitarian action. And he says we can’t comprehend it. All we can do is apprehend, get glimpses. And I appreciate the fact that you said we’re going to dabble in heresy here or there, not intentionally, but we will, because it’s a mystery! And Lord, fill us with wonder again. Sometimes we just make Christianity so flat.

So that leads us, as you said talking about the wilderness—and I do want to go there because … why? Okay, so Jesus hears these affirming words of the Father, these words that express the truth of his love. And the Spirit takes him to the wilderness right away? Come on, man, can’t we just ease into this before we go there.

So, tell us more about the wilderness because so much, as you’ve already pointed out, of Scripture we see happening in the wilderness. There’s a metaphor that maybe we don’t want to talk about and realize. What else would you say about it?

Brad: Anthony, there’s no easing somebody into the wilderness, even if you would have said, all right, Jesus, you have a week, go to REI [Recreational Equipment, Inc – an American retail store], get yourself some gear. It’s still going to be tough. It’s the wilderness.

Plus, Jesus doesn’t get eased in anything. He shows up in a manger. That’s his moment of coming into this world. In some ways, Jesus going into the wilderness was this picture of him coming into our world, God in the flesh, this light in the darkness. But I do think it’s important to understand why Jesus, as he begins his public ministry, begins it with this time of struggle and this journey into the wilderness and this fasting.

And I don’t know to what extent Jesus needed to be prepared for his public ministry. And I’m certainly not going to try to figure that one out. But a journey that’s going to end in a cross might as well start in the wilderness, I think. Mark doesn’t give us much here, just that Jesus was tested by Satan.

In Matthew and Luke, we get a glimpse of just how Jesus was being tempted. I think it all has to do with how Jesus will use his power to fix the world. Robert Capon, who you mentioned earlier, talks about right-handed versus left-handed power. And right-handed power is the power to control, to coerce, the power to force. It’s what we think about as power in the world we live in.

But left-handed power is mysterious. It doesn’t look like power. It’s the power of forgiveness, power of patience, endurance, letting go. And ultimately, this is the power that we see used by God and Jesus Christ through his death and resurrection. I think the temptation of Jesus was the temptation to do a fix-up job on our broken world, to use his power to make a bad world good.

But it was never that way. It was always going to be his death and resurrection that would bring about his kingdom. The world doesn’t need to be made better. It needs to be resurrected. And it’s the same for us. It’s the mystery that is revealed to the disciples and hidden in the parables. This mystery of we find life and death, and we’re not going to find it anywhere else.

And so, I think that this temptation, even at the beginning of Jesus’s ministry as he goes into the wilderness, as he’s tempted, it feels upside down. It feels backwards. But again, God’s kingdom shows us that power doesn’t look like power, that the way that God is working in the world is not going to be the way that we expect.

And Jesus going into the wilderness is a little picture of that.

Anthony: I have no doubt that there are those in our listening audience who feel like they’re in the wilderness right now. And we all are. Living in an evil age, it is wilderness. But for those that are exceptionally feeling that right now, what would you say to them? How would you encourage them?

Brad: I actually think that those of us that feel like we’re living in the wilderness maybe have this blessing because it’s a reminder that we actually need. I worry about the people that don’t need God, or at least that’s the way they see their lives. There’s a gift of being in the wilderness and that is that if eventually we are reminded that the only hope we have is through someone else, then we can find that person.

I would say to those people, yeah, you’re in the wilderness, but you’re not alone. Christ is with you. And in fact, that is where James talks about when you’re—what does he say? That this testing brings about endurance. And I can’t remember exactly what he says in that first part of James, but the wilderness will change you.

And it will make you somebody that’s more like God, and more like Jesus Christ, the light of the world and who he’s called you to be, as well. And if you’re in the wilderness, maybe it’s because God is making you into somebody that can be the light of the world.

And that starts with trusting that he’s with you right there. But it’s hard. It is hard.

Anthony: And maybe in another podcast, if we can get you back here and we talk about this passage of scripture, again. We’ll talk about the Spirit leading Jesus out. There are those Christians who think that God does things to them to teach them, to grow them up, to mature them in Christ, to reveal his presence. God’s a good God. He’s faithful, and he’s kind. Anyway, I’d love to have that conversation at some point. How deterministic is he?

Brad: Yeah, I know. The one thing we do know is that God’s just really good at reconciling and resurrecting. So, I think we experienced God in those moments, and it feels [like] God made me go through this. But God’s just going to go ahead and resurrect anything that will die if we let go. And if we’re in that place and we really do let go and give ourselves away to Christ, that’s where we’ll find the resurrection. Because you can’t resurrect what isn’t dead! I think that’s why it feels like oh, God made me go through this so that I would experience this. But I don’t know I’m not going to try to figure out understanding all that.

Anthony: But you can’t resurrect what isn’t dead. Let’s remember that.


Small Group Discussion Questions

  • The first sentence about the appearance of Jesus in Mark’s gospel is underwhelming. Do you think that Mark was trying to make a point about Christ? If so, what do you think he was trying to say?
  • In your own words, what do you think it means that God tore the heavens at Jesus’ baptism?
  • What are some things we can do during Easter Preparation to remind us of God’s passionate presence with us?

Sermon for February 25, 2024 — Second Sunday in Easter Preparation

Welcome to this week’s episode, a special rerun from our Speaking of Life archive. We hope you find its timeless message as meaningful today as it was when it was first shared.

Program Transcript


Speaking of Life 3014 | A Dead-End Road
Heber Ticas

Have you ever had the experience of following someone in a car when you didn’t know your way around? Before the days of GPS this would be an exercise of trust. When I’m driving, I like to make the decisions. I feel confident in my sense of direction and how to find my way around. So, when I must follow someone else, it is easy to second guess their choices. Especially when the person turns down a road that I think will lead in the wrong direction. For example, what would you do if the person you were following suddenly turned down a road that was marked “Dead End?” I would probably start honking at them and flashing my lights in protest.

In some ways, this is our experience in following Christ. Being a disciple means we follow him because we trust him. But then he leads us down roads that are clearly marked “Dead End.” Surely Jesus knows better than to go in that direction! So, we start honking our horns and flashing our lights to warn him of his mistake. Have you ever been there?

Jesus’ first disciples reacted in much the same way when he told them he was going to travel down a dead-end road to Jerusalem. The long-awaited Messiah made it clear that he was going to travel the road of suffering, rejection and death. For Peter especially, this was a hard road to follow, yet he did. As we follow Jesus, we too will have to follow him down roads that we would rather avoid.

Listen to Jesus’ description of being his disciple:

“If any want to become my followers, let them deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me. For those who want to save their life will lose it, and those who lose their life for my sake, and for the sake of the gospel, will save it.” 
Mark 8:34b-35 (NRSV)

That’s not exactly the road map I would draw up for myself. But as we follow Jesus, we come to trust that he knows the way far better than we do, even if it looks like a dead-end road. In fact, he tells us that he is the way. Because of who he is, we can follow him no matter where he leads. And that is especially true when he travels down a dead-end road.

Mi nombre es Heber Ticas, Hablando de la Vida.

Psalm 22:23-31 • Genesis 17:1-7, 15-16 • Romans 4:13-25 • Mark 8:31-38

We are in the second week of the Easter Prep (Lenten) season, a time when we examine ourselves, seeking to prune the things that no longer serve us so God can grow new life. This week’s theme is trusting in God’s faithfulness. The psalmist writes about God’s faithfulness and his supremacy over all. In Genesis, we read about the unbelievable promises God made to Abraham. In Romans, Paul writes about how God kept his promise to Abraham, the Father of the Faithful. In the passage in Mark, Jesus speaks about the suffering he will faithfully endure in order to redeem humanity.

The Gift of Suffering

Mark 8:31-38 NIV

A father brings his one-year-old daughter to the pediatrician for a checkup. The doctor informs the dad that it is a good time for the little one to get her first vaccination for measles. The father loves his daughter and wants to protect her, so he agrees to let his daughter receive the injection. When the nurse comes in with a little tray, the little girl feels like something is going on and begins to get upset. When the nurse administers the injection, the daughter screams out in pain and cries miserably. She looks to her father and uses her simple words to ask for help, but all he can do is hold her; he can’t stop the pain of the injection. A look of confusion comes across the little girl’s face. She cannot understand why her father would allow this to happen to her. Although the vaccination is good for his daughter and could save her life, the father knows that his little girl has to suffer in order to receive it.

Does this scene sound familiar? If you are a parent, you’ve likely experienced something like this. If you want to become rich, open a candy store or ice cream shop right next to a pediatrician’s office! There would be a continual stream of parents treating their children to sweets to help ease their guilt. Deep within the wiring of human beings is the desire to avoid suffering — both our own suffering and the suffering of those we care about. Even when the suffering serves a good purpose — like protecting us from a disease that still kills thousands of people globally every year — we would rather avoid any pain or discomfort. Of course, it is wise to avoid pain when possible, however, it is unwise to think that we are able to avoid all pain.

Despite the fact that suffering is part of the human condition, many people, to some extent, have distanced themselves from God because he “allows” human suffering. For most of us, if something feels bad, it is bad. It is hard for us to accept that something good could cause suffering. If we are honest with ourselves, all of us would probably admit to sometimes looking at God with the same confusion as the little girl in the doctor’s office. There was a time when in our pain, we turned to God for relief, but the relief did not come when or how we wanted it. We asked God, “If you love me — if you are truly good — then why would you let this happen?” Perhaps you are feeling this way as you hear (read) this sermon.

Given the universality of suffering, Jesus taught on the topic. What Christ says about suffering provides his followers with both comfort and guidance on how to endure suffering. Let’s look at Mark 8:31-38:

He then began to teach them that the Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders, the chief priests and the teachers of the law, and that he must be killed and after three days rise again. He spoke plainly about this, and Peter took him aside and began to rebuke him. But when Jesus turned and looked at his disciples, he rebuked Peter. “Get behind me, Satan!” he said. “You do not have in mind the concerns of God, but merely human concerns.” Then he called the crowd to him along with his disciples and said: “Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me. For whoever wants to save their life will lose it, but whoever loses their life for me and for the gospel will save it. What good is it for someone to gain the whole world, yet forfeit their soul? Or what can anyone give in exchange for their soul? If anyone is ashamed of me and my words in this adulterous and sinful generation, the Son of Man will be ashamed of them when he comes in his Father’s glory with the holy angels.” (Mark 8:31-38 NIV)

Jesus, understanding how hard it is for humans to grasp the concept of necessary and good suffering, wanted to prepare his disciples for what would befall the Son of Man. He taught them plainly, meaning he did not use stories or parables, because he wanted them to understand. Predictably, they did not understand. Peter loved Jesus and rejected the idea of his Lord willingly submitting to being tortured and unlawfully executed. In the disciple’s mind, Jesus’ crucifixion was easily avoidable. Notwithstanding Jesus’ miraculous power, he had enough followers to strenuously resist any arrest by the corrupt Jewish leaders. Plus, he could have simply left Jerusalem. Jesus could have easily avoided capture for years. This was likely going through Peter’s mind as he pulled Jesus aside to admonish him.

Before we start throwing stones at Peter, most of us would do the same thing. Put yourself in Peter’s shoes. Imagine if one of your closest friends told you that they were going to submit to suffering and a death that could easily be avoided. If you are like me, you would have said anything to get them to reject what they believed God was telling them to do. In the desert, after Jesus’ 40-day fast, the Tempter tried to lure Jesus into taking the easy way out of his calling. He offered Christ a crown without the cross. Out of misguided love, Peter’s words were tempting Jesus to accept the enemy’s offer. This is why Jesus called Peter “Satan” in that moment. Without knowing it, Peter was allied with the Tempter.

When we assume that the suffering endured by us or a loved one is bad or pointless, without first seeking God’s mind and heart on the matter, we make the same mistake Peter made. To be clear, not all suffering is good. For instance, suffering as a result of abuse or neglect is not good. While God can make good come out of a bad situation, suffering caused by dehumanization is simply not good. At the same time, pain can sometimes have a purpose. This is important to keep in mind, because Jesus promised that his followers would suffer for his sake. In a society that is actively trying to alleviate all discomfort for those with adequate resources, Christ’s promise of suffering is hard to swallow. Yet, if we truly try to live like Christ, we will experience suffering just as he did. When we ally ourselves with the poor like Jesus, we will suffer like the poor. When we love the stranger like Jesus, we will suffer like the stranger. When we humbly serve the powerless like Jesus, we will suffer like the powerless. The way of Christ is not the way of this world and those who follow him will suffer.

To talk about our suffering, Jesus used the metaphor of taking up our cross and following him. The cross was both horrible and beautiful. It was a source of shame and a source of glory. It is something that had to happen, regardless of any human desire otherwise. This is the image that Jesus used to describe our suffering for his sake. This should cast our suffering for Christ’s sake in new light. To those who are suffering, it is easy to only perceive the pain. However, because God is working within our situation, there will always be grace and beauty to be found. In Christ, our suffering is never pointless and never wasted.

In order to be like Christ, even in his suffering, Jesus says that we must deny ourselves. In this case, denying ourselves means resisting the natural inclination to move towards comfort and painlessness — to accept the Devil’s offer of a crown without a cross. The way of Christ will always move us outside of our comfort zone. His way will move us towards conflict with those who dehumanize our neighbor. His way will cause us to rejoice in the hope of a future reunion when our loved ones get sick and die. This is one of the keys to enduring suffering, and where Peter made his critical error in understanding. In the midst of our pain, we need to turn to God so he can help us have his concerns in mind, not merely human concerns. Instead of telling God we are in pain and asking him to take it away, we could try praying, “Father, I am hurting. Could you please end my suffering. However, if my pain has a purpose, please reveal it so that I can endure with joy and contentment.” Denying ourselves means laying aside our instinct to judge all suffering as bad, because in this present evil age the children of God will experience suffering.

There is also good news in taking up our cross and suffering like Christ. Jesus’ instructions are to follow him as you bear your cross. That means that he is with you. In fact, it means the Jesus is going before you. Whatever situation you are walking into has already been scouted by the Son. He has gone before you and removed anything that could destroy you. Jesus himself has entered your trial and ensured that there is a way out. Whatever human beings have planned for you, Jesus has already promised your victory in this life or the next. What are their plans compared to his promise? If God be for you who can be against you?

May we take comfort in our suffering knowing that Jesus is with us, and he goes before us.

Into the Wilderness w/ Brad Turnage W4

Video unavailable (video not checked).

February 25—Second Sunday of Easter Prep/Lent
Mark 8:31-38, “The Way of the Cross”

CLICK HERE to listen to the whole podcast.


If you get a chance to rate and review the show, that helps a lot. And invite your fellow preachers and Bible lovers to join us!

Follow us on Spotify, Google Podcast, and Apple Podcast.

Program Transcript


Into the Wilderness w/ Brad Turnage W4

Anthony: All right. Our final pericope of the month is Mark 8:31- 38. It is the Revised Common Lectionary passage for the second Sunday of Easter Prep / Lent, which is February 25. Brad, do us the honors, please.

Brad: Sure.

Then he began to teach them that the Son of Man must undergo great suffering and be rejected by the elders, the chief priests, and the scribes and be killed and after three days rise again. 32 He said all this quite openly. And Peter took him aside and began to rebuke him. 33 But turning and looking at his disciples, he rebuked Peter and said, “Get behind me, Satan! For you are setting your mind not on divine things but on human things.” 34 He called the crowd with his disciples and said to them, “If any wish to come after me, let them deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me. 35 For those who want to save their life will lose it, and those who lose their life for my sake, and for the sake of the gospel, will save it. 36 For what will it profit them to gain the whole world and forfeit their life? 37 Indeed, what can they give in return for their life? 38 Those who are ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation, of them the Son of Man will also be ashamed when he comes in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.”

Anthony: Not today, Satan! Poor Peter. This is the second time in our conversation that we see him getting it wrong.

Let’s not waste it. What can we learn from this interaction with Jesus? And why did Jesus rebuke Peter so strongly? And what does that rebuke teach us about the ways of Christ?

Brad: Before we talk about this rebuke of Peter—because it’s maybe the harshest thing Jesus ever says to Peter, and maybe he says to anybody. Get behind me, Satan.

But I want to give Peter credit. Literally just moments before this, Jesus gives Peter maybe the highest praise he’s given anyone in the Gospels. Just a few verses before Jesus says, get behind me, Satan is when Peter confesses Christ and Jesus says, yes, and this was not revealed to you by man, but by my Father. And from now on, Peter, I’m going to call you my rock, and I will build my church on you and the gates of hell will not keep it out.

I want to bring that up because I just love how Jesus lets the good be the good and the bad be the bad, right? He holds onto both of these things. So, in one moment that Peter gets it, he finds this beautiful response from Jesus. And the fact that Peter’s about to blow it, does it change what Jesus just said? And I think that’s so important because we go through our life and we have these moments where God calls us into his work and says, I’m going to do something with you. And then we blow it. And we’ve got to be able to, in those moments, shake it off and go all right, that doesn’t change what else Jesus has said and what else Jesus has called me to.

But this get behind me Satan that he says to Peter, I think it’s more than just calling out Peter. I think we have to go back to the wilderness, right? I think Peter’s doing exactly what Satan was doing to Jesus in the wilderness.

He’s trying to get Jesus to use his power in a different way. Peter’s saying, Jesus, you have the power to save the world without all this death and dying nonsense. That’s Satan. So, when Jesus says, get behind me, Satan, I think he’s talking to Satan more than Peter because what Peter’s doing is that same thing that we see Satan in the wilderness doing and trying to control the way that Jesus is going to change the world.

And Jesus is not going to have any of that because the only way to fix the curse of sin—Paul says the wages of sin is death. What we earn from our sin is death. The only way we’re going to fix it is through going all the way into that death and then resurrecting it.

And for Peter, there’s no way to saving the world that doesn’t involve Jesus’ death and resurrection. And we see that moment Jesus rebukes him, but I think it’s more this rebuking of what Satan is always trying to do, which is to have us not trust the real way that God is going to change the world and change us.

Anthony: Yeah. And Peter’s going to give you a big old hug in the fullness of the kingdom for coming to his aid and reminding us that the good is good and the bad is bad.

And we all participate in it. That’s a good way of looking at it. Get behind me, Satan. So I’m looking at the verses 35 – 38, and in my mind, it’s filled with juxtaposition. Maybe you see it too. So how would you Christologically preach this portion of the text? What say you?

Brad: I think Christologically, you just point to Jesus, because this is exactly how Jesus lived, right? He says those who want to save their life will lose it. Jesus loses his.

So, everything that Jesus is saying here that feels like juxtaposition (sorry, had a hard time saying that one) is because the kingdom really is upside down and backwards. And so, you point to Jesus, you point to all the ways that it’s upside down and backwards. You point to the fact that Jesus shows up in a time of history that he has such a small—in terms of at least globally—impact, right?

How far did Jesus travel from his home? Probably not as far as we’ll travel to visit family for Christmas. It’s upside down and backwards to think that’s the moment that God chooses to send his Savior into the world. You would have thought it would have been in a time where that person would be on TV, where that person would be able to get the message out in this big way.

You would have expected that it wouldn’t have been a—Jesus was basically a homeless man for the time of his ministry. That is upside down and backwards. The fact that Jesus says, love your enemies, the fact that Jesus forgives his enemies, even on the cross is so not the way that we would assume that any God of any taste would behave, but that’s the way our God is.

And so, what does that look like? It looks like giving away our lives and trusting that though it seems upside down and backwards, that really is the place where we’ll find life. And again, I think it’s because if we’re not doing that, then we’re not giving God the room to work. We’re not giving the Holy Spirit the space to do something meaningful because we’re holding onto that steering wheel and not letting go and letting him lead.

Anthony: Yeah, and I’m looking at verse 38, Brad, and if I’m being real with myself, there’ve been times where I’ve been ashamed of Jesus and his words, especially out of my ignorance. And it says that the Son of Man will be ashamed. What do I take away from that? Where’s the good news there?

Brad: So, in 38, “those who are ashamed of me and of my words.” I think in those moments, Anthony, I think you’ve got to, you got to just be really honest that you still have this duality of the old and the new. And the old self, we’ve died with Christ and in one sense, the old self is dead, but it’s a ghost. It has no future, but it’s still ghosting around.

And then the new self is the self that is really alive. And we live with both of these realities. I think that yeah, Jesus is [saying], your old self is the one that’s ashamed. And that’s why we have to put that old self away once and for all, and to disconnect the real you from the false you. And every day my old self makes himself known and but as I’ve gotten older, the more that I’m able to trust that that part of me is the part of me that when I’m dead is going to stay dead.

It’s not the real me. It’s the ghost of my old self. It’s the ghost of Adam. My life really is hidden in my new self, which is in Christ. It’s easy to think that our lives are this zero sum, that as I grow in faith, I become more righteous and less sinful and maybe the good Christian life is getting to 75 percent righteous and 25 percent sinful.

But the more I’ve been honest with myself, the more I think I’ve come to understand Scripture. The truth is my old self is 100 percent dead in sin. There is nothing of real life in my old self. The darkness is really dark. The evil is really evil. And my new self is 100 percent in Christ, resurrected and righteous.

And these two things they have nothing to do with one another, except that they’re both inside this person whose name is Brad. And so, when my old self kind of leads me into falling into sin or saying that thing, I just put it in its place and I’ll say, that’s not me. That’s not the real me and I think that’s what we have to do. I think in our death, once and for all, God will get rid of that old self in our death and then we really will be in the fullness of God’s creation made manifest.

Anthony: Hallelujah that the lying Anthony won’t inherit the kingdom of God. That the one that was ashamed of Jesus’ words won’t inherit the kingdom of God. And I so liked the metaphor you use of ghosting. Wasn’t it Martin Luther that said, the old man was buried in the water, but I found out that old wretch can swim, and he keeps showing up in my life, right?

Brad: And if we have time, I would love to tell you this story. One time I was teaching Colossians to a group of high school students. Colossians 3 has this language about the old self where it says, on account of these things, God’s wrath will be pulled poured out.

And I asked my students, I said, is there anybody that you would love to see God’s wrath poured out on? And they were like, no, how can you say that? And I said, there’s somebody in this room I would love for God’s wrath to be poured out on. And they were like, Brad, how can you say that? And I was like, yeah, and it’s me. At least it’s the part of me that is still struggling with sin.

It’s that old self I want God’s wrath to be poured out on my old self because if it’s not, and my old self gets into the kingdom once and for all, he’s going to ruin it for everybody else. As I live trying to follow Christ and that old self still gets in the way and still causes me to feel ashamed and question and get lazy and gets in the way of what God wants to do, yeah, bring your wrath on that part of me, God and kill it and let it stay dead forever. I’m okay with that.

Anthony: I am too, brother. I have always enjoyed our friendship and your exegesis of Scripture. And this has just been a fun conversation, brother, around Scripture, something we both love. So, thank you for doing this.

And I also want to thank the team of people that make this podcast possible. We couldn’t do it without them. Reuel Enerio and David McKinnon and Elizabeth Mullins. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for your labor of love in service to Christ with Gospel Reverb.

And Brad, it’s our tradition to end with prayer. We’d love to ask you to do it, but thanks again for being a part of this. I really enjoyed it.

Brad: Sure. And thank you for letting me just come here and talk about scripture and Jesus. I love being with you, Anthony, and I really appreciate what you’re doing here. So, let’s pray.

Father God, thank you that you’re the God that resurrects the dead, that you’re the God that brings new life, and that because of your life, death, and resurrection we can experience reality. We can experience your kingdom even here and now, Lord.

So, help us do just that, Lord. Help us learn how to die to ourselves. Help us learn how to let go of those things that we are giving our lives over to, Lord. And let go so that in Christ we might live for the sake of the world. And that the world might see you through your people, Lord.

So, use us to be your light in the world. Lord, use the people that are listening to this to be your light in the world, that their communities, that their workplaces, wherever they are, Lord, people might know you and experience your great love through them. We pray all this in your holy name. Amen.

 


Small Group Discussion Questions

  • Why do you think it is hard for us to accept that suffering is a part of the human condition?
  • Think about the important life lessons you learned. Were any of them learned through suffering? Do you think there was any other way for you to learn that lesson?
  • Can you think of a situation when you thought your suffering was bad at the time but later you realized that what you were experiencing was good?